Petromax 829 flickering light

Discussion in 'Pressure Lamp Discussion Forum' started by Cesar, Sep 22, 2019.

  1. Cesar

    Cesar Chile Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2019
    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Chile, Southamerica
    Hi everybody! My lantern have some faint flicker from the moment it turns on.
    The frecuency is like 2 Herz.
    Is it a characteristic of the lamp or something is wrong?
    20190922_000848.jpg
     
  2. Seamanjive

    Seamanjive Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2019
    Messages:
    187
    Location:
    London, England
    Hi Cesaer...do you have full tank of fuel and sufficient pressure?
     
  3. Cesar

    Cesar Chile Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2019
    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Chile, Southamerica
  4. Seamanjive

    Seamanjive Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2019
    Messages:
    187
    Location:
    London, England
    When my Optimus 1550G had a problem with pulsing after reassembled the vaporiser. I eventually noticed that the needle was protruding more through the jet than it did before it took it apart. I lowered the needle and the pulsing is now gone. It returns if the pressure falls or the fuel level is low. The pulsing also seems to make the tank warm as vaporized fuel moves up and down the column.
    I was only able to solve these problems by following the excellent advice given by the good people on this forum. I take no credit for discovering these solutions myself. The level of experience here is so high and wide.
    Hope this might help you as it has helped me.
    Rgds
    Jamie
     
  5. bp4willi

    bp4willi Germany Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2014
    Messages:
    403
    Location:
    Niers, Germany
    @Cesar
    You need to add a spiral of stranded copper wire in the tube of vaporiser below the Preston loop.
    This helps for more even, continuous vaporisation. Avoids the Leidenfrost effect of pulsing.
     
  6. Seamanjive

    Seamanjive Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2019
    Messages:
    187
    Location:
    London, England
    I'm intrigued by this solution. Does the brass gauze/copper wire go inside the vaporiser tube? How do you get it in there and get the needle through? Anyone got any pictures?
     
  7. bp4willi

    bp4willi Germany Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2014
    Messages:
    403
    Location:
    Niers, Germany
    @Seamanjive
    I regret. Have no pics.
    But is simple.
    Remove jet, needle and upper part of vaporiser.
    Wind stranded wire around the shaft of a screwdriver with appropriate dimension.
    Outer diameter of spiral should match inner diameter of vaporiser tube.
    Spiral should stretch from Preston loop down to the hand wheel, within the vaporiser.
    Push the spiral gently in the tube.
    Put all together again.
    Enjoy flicker free light.
     
  8. Seamanjive

    Seamanjive Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2019
    Messages:
    187
    Location:
    London, England
    Thanks for clear explanation. I think I have solved the problem but will experiment with your method.
    Rgds
    James
     
  9. Cesar

    Cesar Chile Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2019
    Messages:
    27
    Location:
    Chile, Southamerica
    I think in the 50s, you go to a Petromax or another brand technical service, You carry your lamp with a flickering ... what would have been the "official" solution of the company? and I also wonder, our lamps when they were new, did they have flickering problems?
     
  10. george

    george United States Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,382
    Location:
    USA
    All pressure lanterns flicker to some extent, even the best of them. It's normal and most of the time your brain can't pick it up. However, when it does then you have a slight problem.
    Good advice here. Try it and see what happens.
     
  11. ColinG

    ColinG United Kingdom Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2017
    Messages:
    2,163
    I have used the copper wire trick with most of my Petromax clones and it definitely works. My 829 also has a flicker and I'll be using copper wire to cure that too.

    Don't forget to make sure all the other adjustments are set correctly love the fuel air mix and the internal vane that's operated by the grub screw on the J tube. Once all that's done and the wire is in place my guess is it should run nicely without any pulsing.

    To be honest I use a slightly different technique with the wire... I wind it round the pricker rod and then reassemble the vaporiser. It seems to work just as well as far as I can tell it you need to be careful not to damage the pricker wire! I sometimes unscrews it before I start work.
     
  12. Seamanjive

    Seamanjive Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2019
    Messages:
    187
    Location:
    London, England
    That makes sense, wind control rod before inserting it. How close/tight are the windings? And copper or brass? Would copper become molten at the temperatures inside the generator?
     
  13. Graham P

    Graham P Australia Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    Messages:
    807
    Location:
    Albury area NSW AUstralia
    I wonder if the specification of current kerosene is the same as it was in days gone and that is contributing to problems, classic cars do not run well on modern pump petrol ??
     
  14. ColinG

    ColinG United Kingdom Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2017
    Messages:
    2,163
    I found there wasn't much choice in the tightness of the winding but so long as it's there it seems to work. I believe it simply increases the surface area to heat the kero.
     
  15. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2010
    Messages:
    6,071
    Location:
    Hertfordshire
    Brass will always be better than copper in a generator. Copper oxidises to black flaky crap under heat although a generator probably doesn't get hot enough. I would not wind wire around the pricker rod either. Better to roll some brass mesh around it. Mind you the difference is probably minimal and either will work fine. ::Neil::
     
  16. Seamanjive

    Seamanjive Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2019
    Messages:
    187
    Location:
    London, England
    I think I'll give it a go...although I seemed to have currently cured the pulsing with needle/jet/airgap adjustment.

    My current prob is with the 1550 is that the pump leather disintegrated and is in bits at the bottom of the pump chamber. Think I need a dental probe to dig it out. Also, I dont think a Tilley leather is the right size. Mmmmmm..
     
  17. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2010
    Messages:
    6,071
    Location:
    Hertfordshire
    ::Neil::
     
  18. bp4willi

    bp4willi Germany Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2014
    Messages:
    403
    Location:
    Niers, Germany
    @Mackburner
    You share a lot of amazing competence and convincing thought.
    But this time
    I can't agree.
    Copper won't oxidise to flaky black soot ...within the vaporiser ...... Because
    Within the vaporiser is during operation
    Only kero and kero gas
    No oxygen.

    Oxidization will certainly happen. But not in excess.
    Black surface is rather kero coal . similar to cracking process which bursts Tilley vaporisers

    And to avoid flickering, copper has advantage over brass
    Due to better heat conduction in copper than in brass.

    And yes, both, copper and brass stuffing work more effective
    If it touches vaporiser tube from inside. For good heat conduction.
     
  19. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2010
    Messages:
    6,071
    Location:
    Hertfordshire
    OK that makes sense. I stand corrected. ::Neil::
     
  20. WimVe

    WimVe Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2011
    Messages:
    1,678
    Strange that nobody mentions the mix paddle.
    normally the lanterns don't flicker.
     
  21. ColinG

    ColinG United Kingdom Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2017
    Messages:
    2,163
    I've messed around with the mix paddle but it's minimal in it's effectiveness, at least that's what I found. It does something, just not much.
     
  22. george

    george United States Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2011
    Messages:
    1,382
    Location:
    USA
    It will cut down on brightness, at least that's what mine does. It's somewhat minimal but it works. It doesn't have any affect on flickering.
     
  23. WimVe

    WimVe Subscriber

    Offline
    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2011
    Messages:
    1,678
    The flcikering is caused by the "Leidenfrost effect".
    But this was known I guess by the designers.
    I think that the shape of the mantle, the quality of the fuel and maybe not very clean parts will stimulate this effect.

    The mixing paddle is the last object in the gas stream and should be used to make a adjustment to the gasflow by means of reflected light.
    You adjust the brightness, that is optimun gas flow, by looking at the reflected light from a (white) piece of paper.
     

Share This Page