Repairing Bialaddin bowl fire burners with exhaust paste

Discussion in 'Fettling Forum' started by MG, Nov 10, 2019.

  1. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    As above, i'm talking about resealing the two halves/threaded pieces where the burners can leak from when the threads have burnt away, i have read about it but i'm just wondering how successful it has been for anyone that has tried it, i had a go at one last night but it set in the wrong position and i think i repaired one a while back which seemed to work ok iirc, i may have a couple more that i need to do but if it doesn't often work then i won't bother,

    I might also try some copper grease,

    Thanks.
     
  2. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    @MG

    If the threads are really pitted, you should try muffler paste. I happen to have a fair few spare Tilley burners that were assembled by another collector using muffler paste.

    If worse comes to worst you could clean it up and silbraze it together.


    Cheers

    Tony
     
  3. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Tony Press

    Thanks Tony, i have got some GunGum, fibreglass reinforced exhaust/muffler paste so i will have another try, one burner has been put back together by what looks like a punch, the brass upper part has been punched onto the base but can still twist it a few mm's and hence leaks i presume and a couple of the others look like they have been doctored, i will take them apart so that i can try and seal them up properly, i don't want to throw them away if they can be saved as even secondhand they can be relatively expensive to replace.
     
  4. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    If they have been badly damaged, I would silbraze them.

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  5. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Tony Press

    Sadly that is not in my repertoire Tony.
     
  6. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    Then try the muffler paste.

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  7. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    I've got a blow torch although i'm not sure how hot a piece would need to be for silver solder if that's the same as brazing? if i can't get the burners apart how clean has the joint got to be for the solder/brazing to take as i'm not sure how clean i could get the insides?
     
  8. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    Before you go down this path, remember that once done it can’t be undone...

    You’ll need to get the brass very red hot. I use a MAPP torch. I gather some people use propane, but it’s a bit slower to get to the correct temperature.

    Cleanliness is everything in this game so I would clean with citric acid, then with steel wool or similar. I would use a sharp file to make a clean surface at each join.

    Look at the instructions for silver soldering (silbrazing; hard soldering) here:

    SMEX - Silver Soldering

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  9. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    That's great, thanks Tony, i'll leave that as a last resort then and see how i get on with taking the burners apart first in case i can make that work.
     
  10. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    Well i took them all apart, cleaned them although none were dirty, none of the upper parts showed any wear or distortion, reassembled the ones with the tight threads with copper grease and the others with exhaust paste, tried the best three and not really any difference to speak of,

    IMG_8849.JPG
     
  11. george

    george United States Subscriber

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    Two on the left in picture look like they're shot. Three on right look pretty good.
    :-k
     
  12. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    And the top one on the left works as well as the others, i haven't tried the one bottom left, i will rig them up on a working lantern tank and control cock and if that doesn't work then i'm stumped.
     
  13. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    @MG

    Is your fuel ok?

    Do you smell kerosene fumes while it’s burning?

    If you are using aircraft-grade kerosene and all is well you should get no smell.

    Tony
     
  14. AussiePete

    AussiePete Australia Subscriber

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    Bloody hell ... the 2 on the left have done a bit of work.
    Cheers
    Pete
     
  15. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Tony Press

    Yes fuel is fine, i only use Paraffin Extra now, there is a smell but i put that down to the heater running rich with the symptom being the halo around the mantle.

    @AussiePete

    And i dressed up the bottom one as it was in even worse condition beforehand.
     
  16. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    @MG

    Try mixing 15% naphtha: 90% paraffin in your heater.

    Naphtha = Coleman Fuel.

    Tony
     
  17. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Tony Press

    Thanks Tony, that would be fine if i was keeping it but not sure the new owner would be ok using that mix, i haven't had any problems with the Paraffin Extra before and it burns much nicer than the Barrettine Paraffin that i previously used (which was fine in other bowl fires, maybe i should try some in this one) the nos vapouriser works fine in a lantern so i wonder why all three burners aren't working correctly in this instance?
     
  18. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    Perplexing...

    Tony
     
  19. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    That is one word to describe it Tony :lol:
     
  20. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    @MG

    I’m sure you’ve thought of other unprintable expressions...

    Cheers

    Tony
     
  21. MYN

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    The bottom left one looks challenging. Might worth a try building that up with the exhaust/muffler paste and re-perforating it accordingly.
     
  22. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Tony Press

    Many my friend! and it gets worse the harder i try to fix the issue, i don't know enough to work out things like air/fuel ratios or whatever else might be causing the problem but you would think it can't be something that difficult, these are usually a robust heater.
     
  23. jacov

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    @MG Just a thought, could it be that the mesh mantle is not allowing enough air into the interior thereof to allow a complete burn?
    I experienced this a while ago when trying to make a mesh mantle, only after I made two holes, approx 4 millimeters in diameter, did it burn well

    Thanks

    Jaco
     
  24. george

    george United States Subscriber

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    Hummm..:-k
     
  25. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @MYN

    I'm not sure i'll bother with that one as it is so far gone,

    @jacov

    Was that on a Tilley heater? i think i remember reading that thread,
    I have tried three different, genuine Bialaddin mantles so i don't think all three would be unserviceable but going by the burners who knows!
     
  26. MYN

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    I'd guess you have enough spares to bother about the one at the bottom left of the picture.
    I've mended similarly shot burners with muffler paste, and they could perform surprising well after that. So if you could ever fix the worst one of the lot, the others should not pose any serious issues.
     
  27. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    You did well to be able to mend one in that condition Myn, it didn't even enter my mind that it was repairable,

    I wish i could figure out what the problem is considering the fairly decent condition of the other three.
     
  28. MYN

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    Do not use copper slip/antiseize if the threads are too badly burnt and not securing well enough. The heated parts would expand, loosen and the attachment might just drop out.
    Either muffler paste or silbraze.
     
  29. JonD

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    Is the common part here the mixing chamber dome and air tube? If the fuel is right (vapouriser and tank) and it runs rich, surely it lacks air.
     
  30. MG

    MG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @MYN

    Yes i only used copper grease on the tight threads all others exhaust paste,

    @JonD

    From what i can see, there is no wear to the mixing chambers/domes, i cleaned them by heating and quenching although they weren't that coked up and i made sure the air tubes etc were clear by using a pipe cleaner.
     

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