Vapalux 300 - brass tank

Discussion in '300' started by David Shouksmith, Oct 10, 2010.

  1. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    My understanding is that the brown font version of these lanterns dates from the start of Vapalux production (somewhere between 1938 and 1940 depending on who you believe) and 1942 when the Tilley-type pressure 'tit' was discontinued.

    This one has a brass tank which I presume is earlier, these being subsequently discontinued due to shortages of brass which was diverted to the production of ammunition...

    1286718701-Vapalux_300_brass1.jpg 1286718728-Vapalux_300_brass2.jpg
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 1, 2017
  2. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

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    I cannot believe 1938. The earliest patent for any part of this is about mid 1940 and you can bet the farm that Willis and Bates did not market anything they did not have a patent application for. So late 1940 is going to be the earliest date for any Vapalux lantern. ::Neil::
     
  3. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    I did say, "depending on who you believe".

    The confusion surrounding the start of Vapalux production and the myth that you can date them by colour (see Pressure Lamps International etc.) seems to have arisen from a letter written by Peter Sunderland, Works Manager at Bairstows and sent to a London collector.

    The contents of this letter seem to be, er, fanciful to say the least...
     
  4. Ian Ashton

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    Totally fanciful David and a shame really because all the info he needed was sat at the side of him in the Office Safe in the form of the Works Diaries........
     
  5. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    And here's the very letter (30 months late but never mind).

    When I got this copy of the letter, someone had obliterated the collector's name but the black cross at the top right hid nothing! I've further removed his personal details to protect his privacy although I've never heard of him as a collector - and given the letter was written 27 years ago he may have passed to Lampie Heaven by now. Anyway (and treat almost EVERYTHING in this letter with a barrel-full of salt.) :-

    Vapalux letter - processed.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2020
  6. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

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    Yes I have seen that letter before and I should also have a copy which I don't seem to have scanned. I remember at the time I spoke with Peter Sunderland to ask about E41 and he was not aware they had made such a model so I seem to recall I sent him a copy of the instruction card to "prove" they had. ::Neil::
     
  7. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    Neil, have you any idea what pressure lanterns they might have been making in 1912? Perhaps they all went down with the Titanic and they didn't make any more.

    There was that odd Bialaddin (?) thingie they made in collaboration with Blanchard around 1925 - see page 13 in Ian's book. I recall you eventually prized one out of the possession of someone at the Historic Lighting Club. Perhaps they started making it a decade or so earlier. I recall also that, according to their former website, they made stuff for Petromax as well as Tilley. Maybe it was something related to that...
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2020
  8. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @David Shouksmith ... do you mean the Hand lamp ?
     
  9. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    That's the one...

    Bialaddin Blanchard.jpg
     
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  10. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    You're right, it is more of a 'Thingie' ..
    .. described there as a 'Hurricane Lamp for Yachtsmen'.. but you wouldn't want to try and light it in a Hurricane??
     
  11. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    The perspective is odd - I think it's set at an angle with the globe at the front so it looks bigger. As it is, you couldn't set it down anywhere without it burning whatever it's sitting on. I think the bit at the back is a means of attaching it to a wall or upright (a mast?).

    I think Neil did post a pic of his but it was ages ago and heaven knows where it's got to. Maybe in the gallery - it should be... [-o<

    Here:- Bialaddin 1923 Hand Lamp

    It can only be meant for mounting on a vertical surface - note that the angle of the lamp part is at the same angle as the mounting plate at the rear. The tank must slope down towards the front...

    It's interesting that Aladdin used the trade-name Bialaddin first when they were in partnership with Blanchard then later when they were in partnership with Willis & Bates. I realise now that W&B had nothing to do with the handlamp above - should have read it properly from the start... :doh:Maybe the Gallery post needs to be moved - or re-thought...
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2020
  12. Anthony

    Anthony Australia Subscriber

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    Very much not wanting to take the thread away from the Blanchard connection, this is from "Aladdin, the magic name in lamps".

    IMG_3446.jpg
     
  13. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    :-s :? Well, I volunteer at a railway museum and a lot of that's news to me. Say no more... :-k
     
  14. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

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    News to me as well. The colours might be about right for the locomotives Etc. but brown and blue Bialaddins to define BR versions? Not hardly. I suspect I know where Bill got that info from and I won't speak ill of the dead but an ex railway guy who knew BR used Bialaddin lanterns and perhaps didn't understand the models too well. ::Neil::
     
  15. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    No, not even right for them. Ties and cap badges, definitely, to denote the regions but locos, not that I know of.

    Surely you remember the Norwegian Blue, Neil - beautiful plumage... ;) :lol:
     
  16. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

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    Well I've seen locos in those colours. I remember getting close to a blue A4 at Grosmont a while back and I know there is a green one. I also well remember the Hooton-Woodside train being hauled with a brown side tank of some persuasion. ::Neil::
     
  17. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    The blue A4 would have been Sir Nigel Gresley, currently being re-built in the NRM at York. IIRC, the other five are green, although the one that lives in the USA might also be blue (and chrome!). That's the point really, the big four railway companies weren't tied to any particular colour. My favourite loco, Green Arrow 4771 (from LNER) is, er, green. My next favourite, Winston Churchill from the Southern Region is also green (although a slightly different shade). They're currently living next to each other at Locomotion, Shildon. The L.M.S. 'Black 5s' were all, unsurprisingly, black.

    I wasn't aware Dr. Richard Beeching was an accountant. Before he got the B.R. job, he was Chairman of I.C.I. Hmmm...
     
  18. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    :thumbup: ..I do remember when you had to change at Hooton (on the way up from Chester)..and didn't you have to change again at Rock Ferry? That was a while back, tho :)
     
  19. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    Hey, stop de-railing my thread! ;) :lol:
     
  20. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    Whoops! :-# Apologies..(got me coat on)
     
  21. David Shouksmith

    David Shouksmith United Kingdom Founder Member

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    No need for your coat - just put the thread back on track... ;) :lol:
     
  22. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    Ok, i'll try...
    I helped out for a while at a boatyard near Chester. What have boats to do with railways, you may ask?
    Well, this historic boatyard was once owned by the Shropshire Union Railway and Canal Co. then got taken over by the L.N.W.R ( London and North Western Railway ) and then the L.M.S. ( London, Midland and Scottish) which, as mentioned earlier had there own paint colour schemes.
    I can verify for there being evidence at the yard for the colours of Bialaddin (maroon reds) and also Vapalux (chocolate browns). The nice folks that are currently running the yard and slowly restoring the listed buildings have also found it hard to determine original faded paint with known railway colours, as folks on CPL also have with matching faded colours on Lamps with paints available.
    Hope that is nearer the 'points' ? Or do we need the crane? ;)

    There was also another thread on here , not too long ago, about Railway paint schemes?
     
  23. Anthony

    Anthony Australia Subscriber

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    Was it this one you were thinking about?
     
  24. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    Yes! That be the one! .. It's got the link from Jeff..

    Cheers @Anthony ..:thumbup:
     
  25. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

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    I lived until I was 20 about a mile from Rock Ferry station and the cutting for the main line was at the bottom of the garden. The whole world would shake twice a day when an iron ore train blasted through 'cos they were the only service that didn't stop at Rock Ferry. The small Hooton train was known locally as Hooton Annie but I never knew where it serviced. I guess the Deeside of the Wirral service to Parkgate Etc. ::Neil::
     

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