X246A Burner Help

Discussion in 'Fettling Forum' started by Gary Waller, Apr 30, 2020.

  1. Gary Waller

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    I’m currently fettling a X246A from 1964. Can someone help please and advise what burner is correct?
    732532E4-AE1E-4CDE-BDEF-40F5CB515F0A.jpeg 2AB855AC-2550-4FCE-AAD3-3A23EC691C00.jpeg
     
  2. JonD

    JonD Subscriber

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    The second one with 3x threaded and knurled collars in my opinion.
    The collar and split pin came later more like 1970s.
     
  3. Gary Waller

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    @JonD cheers I thought as much just wasn’t sure.
     
  4. AussiePete

    AussiePete Australia Subscriber

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    @Gary Waller
    Yes, what @JonD said. I have 3 example of the X246A and they all have the 3 threaded ferrules that screw onto the air tubes to retain the burner in its hood.
    Cheers
    Pete
     
  5. Gary Waller

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    @AussiePete
    Cheers Pete.
    I will share the full fettle as soon as it’s done.
     
  6. X246A

    X246A United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Gary Waller

    All as above but the newer style burner will work too, although in many cases not quite so brightly.

    Regards Jeremy
     
  7. Gary Waller

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    @X246A Cheers Jeremy.
    Interesting comment re brightness, it’s something I have not thought about, is the general consensus that the older burners are better, if so why?
    Thinking about it my best working lamps tend to be the older ones.
     
  8. JonD

    JonD Subscriber

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    I like the old ones because they are bigger. That means they have more surface area and so they can disspate heat more effectively.
    I think they work better due to lower running temperature.

    I like to ensure that the vapouriser and burner mate nicely so that heat will transfer between them. Without that I think the vapouriser is more likely
    to overheat leading to the dreaded pregnant vapouriser syndrome.
     
  9. Gary Waller

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    @JonD yeah that make sense in essence the mixing dome is larger resulting in better combustion. One thing I have also noticed is partial fouling due to poorly fitted burning tubes.
    I guess one of many reasons why some Tilleys are brighter than others.
     
  10. X246A

    X246A United Kingdom Subscriber

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  11. Gary Waller

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    @X246A interesting, it’s something I didn’t really consider. I’m currently in process of fettling burners (as I’m bored) from scrap tops. Soaked in citric acid first, this makes them easier to dismantle, then a buff up. Some of them when I took them apart where really clogged with carbon.
    357EEEEF-1363-4823-A08A-92F166E70D2E.jpeg
     
  12. X246A

    X246A United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Gary Waller

    Wow, they have cleaned up nicely.

    Regards Jeremy
     
  13. JonD

    JonD Subscriber

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    @Gary Waller @X246A
    You have reminded me that I need to order another (maybe 2) of those burners from JulianDS.

    I was negligent last winter and I left an X246B running unattended. It went into overburn up in the dome and when I came back it was cherry red.
    I knew I was facing bad news - here it is. The air tubes sag downwards due to the weight of the hood. A good Tilley buying tip. Inspect the burner tubes. Sad and sagging down air tubes mean big trouble - avoid.

    I agree they are much better than the stock small burner usually fitted to X246Bs. I didn't think they were used on X246As but I can be wrong.

    20190705_105344.jpg

    By the way if you want to get them to bits I find this works well.
    Once the jubilee clip is tight then it will snag in the jaws of a vice allowing the dome to be unscrewed without crushing or marring the surface. Maybe it even squeezes in the sides and eases stuck threads somewhat? I didn't need to heat it to come apart though it might have helped.

    IMG-20140702-02033_opt.jpg
    IMG-20140702-02032_opt.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2020
  14. Gary Waller

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    The jubilee clip is a good idea I’ll try that, because yes if your not careful you crush the dome. I also find that the spigots are very soft and easily crushed.
     
  15. X246A

    X246A United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @JonD

    That is impressive in a rather sad way. If you buy from Julian Shaw go direct to his website as it is cheaper than EBay.

    Regards Jeremy
     
  16. AussiePete

    AussiePete Australia Subscriber

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    @JonD
    I do the same however I use a strip of thin rubber, from a car tyre’s inner tube, under the jubilee clip to prevent any marking to the softish brass dome. It works very well.
    Cheers
    Pete
     
  17. Simon Morriss

    Simon Morriss United Kingdom Subscriber

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    I'm new to working on Tilley Lamps though I did use them as a Scout 40 years ago. I have a burner with 3x threaded and knurled collars which I can't undo and it still in the hood of the lamp. Any ideas how I can release them please. Simon
     
  18. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    Hello Simon, Welcome to CPL!
    There is lots of info on here if you want to do a search?
    failing that, someone with more experience than me will hopefully be along shortly!
     
  19. Tony Press

    Tony Press Australia Subscriber

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    @Simon Morriss

    Try using some penetrating oil on the threads and joint of the knurled nut. Let it sit for a few hours. Then, using locking multi-grip pliers with the air tube shrouded in a leather strip, and the knurled nut also, unscrew the nut.

    If that fails, try the process all over again but this time apply some heat to the air tube first.

    Cheers

    Tony

    Edit: Don’t squeeze the air tubes or the nuts. Just enough grip to hold and not spin.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2020
  20. X246A

    X246A United Kingdom Subscriber

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    @Simon Morriss

    Hi and welcome to the forum.

    Sometimes trying to undo these bushes can, if seized irreparably damage the burner considering this type is 50+ years old, so my question is do you really need to disassemble the burner?

    If it has blockages within the burner which can’t be poked out or blasted out with compressed air and disassembly is the only option to make it work then you would try heating and quenching and also the use of penetrating fluid may assist.

    I’m sure more suggestions will be along soon however a description of the actual problem and possibly a photograph or two may assist in finding the best solution.

    Regards Jeremy
     
  21. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

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    Simon. This damn virus is not helping here. You can't be more than 10 minutes down the A5 from me and I can't suggest you bring it here for a chat and maybe some assistance because I am banged up in solitary for the duration. Those burner air tube caps can get very tight and the normal way to release stuck brass threads is to heat to dull red and quench in cold water. Problem is you can't do that with these because it will damage the enamel of the hood. I suggest a long soak in a 50/50 mix of acetone and ATF. I find a long pickle in that stuff will often release things. You need to be careful with an old Tilley burner. Sometimes when trying to remove the end caps the whole air tube unscrews from the burner main casting and because with prolonged use the heat damage to the threads will not allow them to scew back in and seal the burner is destroyed. Basically Tilly burners die of old age and somtimes, as Jeremy suggests, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Clean out what you can reach and give it a try. ::Neil::
     
  22. Gary Waller

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    This is how bad things have got I’m now studying Tilley burners....](*,)
    The pics below shows the difference from “old” and “newer” burners, significantly larger burning dome and longer internal tube. (Probably not the correct terminology)
    B44A17F8-7FAE-4BD1-9E8E-A562EFEBCA53.jpeg 7C1C9BE0-BDBB-4FA7-8E12-CCF5B1033D09.jpeg
    Also now an example of a knackered burner that I managed to get apart, now I’ll throw it in the bin..:rage:
    36B878E3-53D6-47BD-85CF-04134D795D3B.jpeg AF9ED128-65BC-47C6-8E26-0325F2E99AA1.jpeg 7F5B7B8A-D288-4271-90DD-CCCBDAB5B67D.jpeg
     
  23. george

    george United States Subscriber

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    Been there, done that! Real nightmare! It seems once the air tubes are removed from one of these, the less likely you are to ever get them screwed back in.
    Your's is really shot to hell!
     
  24. Simon Morriss

    Simon Morriss United Kingdom Subscriber

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    Love the chat thanks everyone. I hadn't realised there was such a community out there.

    As suggested I have added a couple of photos.

    I don't think it's blocked I just wanted to get it apart. Being new to this I'm like a kid, I just don't want to break it before I get it working.

    Thanks for all the tips.

    Simon
     

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  25. podbros

    podbros United Kingdom Subscriber

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    We've all been there, Simon... But you are right about not wanting to break it before you see it lighting...

    You will just have to get more lamps! :lol:
     
  26. Mackburner

    Mackburner United Kingdom Founder Member Subscriber

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    Looks like that burner might be OK. I would probably not bother dismantling it before trying the lamp wihout fitting a mantle to see if a good Bunsen flame is there. ::Neil::
     
  27. Simon Morriss

    Simon Morriss United Kingdom Subscriber

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    When you say with out the mantel, I didn't think that would be ok.

    So just try and light is a normal but with out the mantel?

    Simon
     
  28. Emiel

    Emiel Netherlands Subscriber

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  29. AussiePete

    AussiePete Australia Subscriber

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    That looks like a good burn there @Emiel

    From my limited experience, it’s marvellous how well some Tilley burners keep on working although they look like they’re buggered, burnt out and kaput.
    Cheers
    Pete
     
  30. Emiel

    Emiel Netherlands Subscriber

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    That's right Pete. Just look at the way the air tubes are sagging. I was worried it would not be worth fettling, but a quick test proves this burner can still be used. At least the foreseeable future.
     

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