Petromax 829B is it original?

I'm amazing because the fount is painted. Is this how they originally came?

 

I'm asking*, not amazing.

Do the 829B found not have any markings?

 

It looks pretty striking with good colour choice.
No, I don't think it was originally painted. The entire lantern should have a silvery, non-glossy appearance like the frame.
It appears like a Petromax Bundeswehr for the Army. Should have a straight vaporizer/generator. Originally intended to run on 'Benzin' or gasoline.

 

No this is not original. Not for civilian nor for army versions.
Original Petromax lanterns where never painted. Except the war time versions, green/black.

The polished NATO/BW version was all over matt grey polished. Even the blow pipe of the rapid, the pressure indicator, hand wheel assembly (minus handwheel).
If I look at the outer hood I see scratches of some kind of polish action. Also on the first picture something isn't right with the inner hood.

The only original BW version would be the globe cage.

Although they (the NATO/BW versions) where first outfitted with straight vaporisers, the right one is the normal coil version. As also demanded by the German army later one.



Edit: Looks like the seller is fraudulous. If he/she is selling it as original NATO/BW.
As for the tank it should be marked.

 

Gasoline? Should this be used with white gas instead of kerosene?

Here are a couple other pictures. The tank was painted then. I don't see any of the usual markings in the tank through the paint.

 

@WimVe
What do you think this lantern is? Do you think it's an attempt to fake a German army lantern?

 

Yes it is a fake NATO/BW lantern.

Mind you: the straight vaporiser was in the beginning original.

 

Thank you. I'm glad I asked here first before getting swindled.

 

Problem is that parts are still around. The army stock pile of lanterns is, my guess, already sold out in army dump stores.
So what is left are , piles of parts, strange combinations and/or Hipolito/Geniol versions.

These Geniol and Hipolito are good lanterns (if original) but they are not Petromax lanterns.
I am pretty sure that the Petromax lanterns came in the metal box with trap door at the front and the later versions with the opening only at the top.
But again in the army stock piles and during exercises they can easily been mixed up.

A nos Geniol version is still for sale for around 150,00euro nowadays.
A few years ago the nos Petromax ! did cost 100,00euro. So a fraction of what a new made one cost. Also spare parts (as a set) are getting pretty expensive. These where or scrapped or lost in transition or MIA.

 

For the money : look at this ebay aution.
A lot of money but shipping such a box is not cheap either.
It looks more or less complete. No lanterns, candles, fuel containers, matches.....
But it clearly shows the markings on the tank.

 

What do you mean by "nos"?

I'm going to see Hipolito in a few days. The price is in line with what you're describing.

I did find it interesting that someone went through all that trouble or make a fake. It does look good, but I wonder if it would work?

What do you think he used for a tank?

 

That's not a bad price for two complete lanterns. Thank you for making me aware of it.

 

NOS —> New Old Stock.

Cheers

Tony

 

As far I can see,all components on your Petromax 829 B are original 1959/60.Only the color of the pressure vessel and the heat shield are not original.These parts were painted over.The empossed engraving of the Petromax symbols was at times only very weak ,so you can see it under the thick paint I can't recognize it anymore.

I just took a photo of my Petromax 829 B for comparison,which is the same age.

 

@Reinhard, the valve assembly of a NATO/BW version should be matt grey, as the other parts I wrote.
Parts may look original but they don't match the army version.

 

These parts ,including the flame tube ,were painted gray when Heinze took over production, but not immediately.

 

It looks pretty real and good to me . What's the asking price? I probably wouldn't mind getting swindled with that one .
No idea if any of parts had be interchanged over the years but those are certainly not made in China .
The rapid preheater design matches those from the 1950s. The pricker/cleaner control wheel might had originally been blue but had darkened much over time. The new blue knobs/wheels from China won't darken in such manner no matter how long you try to 'age' them. Same goes for the pump knob.
Maybe someone had attempted to customize it a little.

Yes, Benzin would be gasoline in German. That was the reason the Preston loop generator was replaced with a straight one.
I don't think they had used white gas (natural gasoline without the additives). If I'm not wrong, they had earlier used leaded gasoline, which, was conceived as a more convenient fuel for the Army.
The idea had since been withdrawn due to toxicity and other operational issues during use.
Although it can run perfectly with both white gas and modern gasolines, most of us would not be too keen on that due to some safety issues.
That Petromax wasn't designed with full safety features to operate with highly volatile and inflammable fuels such as gasoline. A typical white gas-fueled Coleman lantern would have the full set of safety features for such operations.

 

@MYN
He's asking a little over $400. As for the fuel... what kind of fuel should be used in this? Your posts makes it sound like I wouldn't be able to use any easily available fuel safely.

 

@Reinhard
What kind of fuel do you use in your 829b?

From your picture, it does appear to be the same as the one I posted.

 

Hmm..I thought I could see maybe the trace of a marking in one of the pics?



something there..?

 

I can't tell. It looks like that's where the sea horse should be. It could be a reflection. Wouldn't it be very difficult to reproduce a fuel tank like this?

 

@Gilbert
I use Super 95 from the gas station.
I would replace the seals , do a leak test in a bucket of water,attach a mantle ,refuel and put the Petromax into operation
This 829B looks good.

 

Will gas station gasoline clog the carburetor like it does on Coleman lanterns? I do have ethanol free fuel available to me if that makes a difference.

 

Petromax petrol carburetors in particular are very robust and easy to clean.But they don't clog up so quickly.

 

Would kerosene be safer to use than gasoline in the 829B?

 

Yes of course,but then you have to install a kerosene carburetor

 

That is much easier than converting a coleman. Will the new carburetors fit right in without the need for additional fittings or hardware?

 

Yes,but the old top parts of the carburetors fit better because the threads have changed slightly.

 

@Gilbert
Yes, you can still use petrol or gasoline in the 829B. If you're concerned that it might carbon up too quickly, then Coleman, Crown or similar white-gas type, high-volatility fuels might be a better choice.

Kerosene would be a safer choice as the fuel. The Petromax 829B design was basically based on the Petromax 829, which is a kerosene-fueled lantern. Except for the generator, the 829B is in essence, more of a kero-fueled device like the 829.
A Preston loop generator, like those found in the Petromax 829 or 523 would be better suited for kerosene vaporization.

If, in any case, you prefer to use the 829B like how it was originally intended, then do ensure that all rubber or elastomer seals are in perfect condition. Extra caution is necessary. Any kind of fuel leakage cannot be tolerated because it might lead to a disastrous outcome.
In particular, the rubber pips found in the pump NRV and that in the foot valve, located at the end of the fuel pick up tube.
Those rubber pips have a tendency to swell and fail when under prolonged immersion in gasolines(modern unleaded). For pips and elastomeric seals, Viton is more gasoline-resistant than buna-N or nitrile.
Neoprene, natural rubbers or silicone rubbers are not resistant.
The lantern does not have any shut off valves to reliably stop the fuel flow. The pump does not have a needle-valve stem to prevent any fuel backflows in case the NRV fails. It also does not have that 'snorkel' tube at the pump's end that only allow air, instead of fuel to leak out.
The only way to stop fuel flow is by relieving the fount pressure. This isn't the safest method when the operating fuel happens to be volatile.

 

After reading your comment on this, I think I would feel better if I changed the carburetor to one with a Preston loop. I would rather err on the side of caution.

I've read somewhere on this forum that the German army actually issued an advisory against using gasoline in the 829B.