https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udWg7hE0_aQ&fbclid=IwAR0albmnPTcOsWpIkV-rPsLfwhEdK9r4wXl11pChmNYzuBIqS4bwljE-UDc
Not wishing to be the "Cassandra" here but I offer the following thoughts: 1) Acetylene breaks down rapidly (and may explode) in contact with copper. I do not know about brass. 2) It is exploisive at between 2.4% and 83% mix with air. 3) With regard to 2 all the carbide lamps I have seen use a burner made partially of of volcanic rock or similar no doubt to stop the flame running back up anywhere. 4) I have never seen a carbide lamp with a mantle (but others may know better) but see pressure point below: 5) After the carbide as reacted out you are left with a soggy ash - which needs to be cleaned out. 6) Acetylene will explode if compressed at about 29PSI (depending on other factors)- this is why carbide lamps are quite low pressure affairs. (the stuff in bottles for welding is dissolved in acetone with a carbon matrix) in the UK the pressure limit for acetylene welding equipment is 9Psi.
Use a proper acetylene cylinder as the tank with the absorbant in it. Make sure to use flashback arrestors on the hoses leading to the burner. Don't ever attempt to channel the gas into a propane canister and compress the pure stuff. Acetylene is unstable by nature and can even explode on its own without oxygen if the pressure's beyond 1 or 2 bar(15~30psi). Do not use copper tubes or anything with silver in it for the gas since some explosive copper or silver acetylide might form over time at the wrong places. Definitely not a safe experiment. I have used MAPP gas as fuel for pressurized lamps instead. Its much safer than acetylene but still burns hotter than propane.
I'm not sure why but I bought an Oxweld Rail Road lamp-- I am not into Crarbide lamps- but it looked cool and the price was right-- so now I own it~~~ doing some research on how they work it seemed to me to not be a whole lot different than a propane lantern ~~~~~~~ so I had to try and build one-- still waiting for my Carbide to arrive-- but this is what we have so far!!
just to clarify the porpane tank is not going to be used as a pressure vessel, the schrader valve has been drilled out , it is merely a generating chamber for the carbide-- and the valve on the propane burner will first be left completely open-and there will be no build up of pressure-- also I had no thought that a blow back of flame might be possible ( hence using lava rock as a precaution) but to be on the safe side I am going to use some steel wool in the burner tube that will allow the gas to pass but act as a fire stop, thank you that was a good warning! ~~~ also the initial burn will only use a tiny bit of calcium carbide, and before that I will do a bubble test with a separate little set up just to get a rough idea of how much gas is generated per amount of solid Carbide--thank you all for the input--as I said this is all new to me--
It sure looks nice, but apart from what already has been pointed out, you seem to lack a couple of other standard safety functions aswell! Your water tank seems to be pretty airtight, which isn't allowed! You must have what's called "safety holes" on it. Most Swedish carbide lamps just used a couple of tiny holes in the lid for the water tank, and that's all it takes there. They must never be larger than 0.8 mm (it's the from same size as Davy's safety mesh used in the old days), and must always be pricked before each lighting to ensure they are clear. The drip system must work in a way that any slight overpressure will force the formed acetylene go by the drip spindle and out to the water tank. That's why you must have the proper ventilation there. It will allow excess gas to pass out throught the holes, and the correct size will prevent any flame to go back down. It will only burn with a very sooty flame from these safety holes. For the same reason, the orifices of the burner never shall be larger than 0.8 mm either. But a flame arrestor on the actual burner is seldom needed. However, it's not wrong, and is generally there indirectly since you really should have a sort of filter somewhere there to pick up moist and lime that might come along up in the tube. Often a loosely rolled piece of cotton cloth down the tube is sufficient. But your burner must be of a kind that is very loosely fitted to the gas pipe! That's also an important safety device carbide lamps have. Just a slight overpressure will make the acetylene explode, and therefore lamps are constructed in a way that the burner will pop if the orifice should get blocked, rather than having the entire thing blow up in your face. I'm sure you have seen the extrememe taper and coarse threadings most acetylene lamp burners use? That's just to make them pop out at very low pressure. What kind of burner do you intend to use? I assume that you will have it mounted upwards, and not inverted as the regular propane/gasolie/kerosene burners?
Hi Bruce, Just to say please be very careful.. Even a correctly set up Acetylene welding/cutting set can backfire and bypass its flame traps ? Just trying to help, Best regards Pb
I have several carbide lamps and play with them on a regular basis. Caution is needed here, as acetylene combined with oxygen is violently explosive when confined. For more information, Google how the old car gas headlight systems worked. They usually had an acetylene generator mounted on the running board, or a Prestolite tank. The gas was piped forward to the headlights where it burned in "Y" shaped ceramic burners with tiny holes......producing needle shaped flames that were quite bright. First of all, the amount of gas is controlled by how rapidly the water is admitted to the carbide chamber NOT by a control valve. To control or stop the gas, you just control or shut off the water. It might work though, although you will still be producing gas if water is allowed inside. Any leaks in your lantern will allow acetylene outside the lantern. Second, the production of acetylene gas is quite moderate and builds up no real pressure, so I'm not sure if it will rise and be pushed through the burner to the mantle. Third, if you look at the burner tip on that Oxweld lamp, you'll see it has an extremely small orifice. That's how all the carbide lamps I've seen are built. The modest pressure pushes the gas through a needle size orifice and is ignited, producing a long bright white flame. I would think a large hole (like your burner) would produce a lazy, smoky flame........not enough pressure........or flashback to the tank, causing one Hell of a bang if any oxygen is in there. Now if you had a burner with one small hole, it might heat up a mantle. The other poster is correct about the gas bypassing flame traps, so you might want to test run it outside.
After posting the above, I have some real misgivings about your experimental lantern. Let's assume you start dripping water on the carbide below. You let the gas build up and bleed of the first two batches to exclude any oxygen, just for safety. Now you place a lit match under the burner and ignite the gas. Here's what can happen.... The burner will ignite with a sluggish, black, smokey flame that will not support a mantle. Just makes a big mess really. Or......... More oxygen leaks in through the water system and mixes with the acetylene. The match ignites the gas which flashes back to the tank where it ignites, creating an explosion. The only exits where that pressure can get out is through the burner, or blowing the water tank off the side and I don't think that's enough relief. The result is a small, but pretty potent hand grenade. You mentioned the old Big Bang cannons. I had one as a kid and played with it quite a bit. They were safe, since the amount of powdered carbide was small and the air chamber large.....PLUS.....the opening of the gun muzzle was large allowing the "bang" a place to get out. I mentioned acetylene lamps having a needle sized burner opening. Actually that's not correct. The hole in those things is so small that you didn't clean it out with a "pricker", you replaced the burner. Those burners (tips) were common accessories for miner's lamps. Also, they were made of "lava" according to the old information, not ceramic. I don't really know what kind of "lava" stone they used, but that was their description. Not poo poohing your lantern experiment in any way....it's just that I see several potential problems that could result in injury. Be safe. We NEED you here on this forum! Miner's lamps are started by: Fill upper chamber with water. Place nugget sized calcium carbide in the bottom chamber. Verify the drip rate of the control before screwing it together. Open the valve and cup your hand over the burner tip. Wait a few seconds and draw your hand sideways, rolling the flint striker. The sparks ignite the acetylene into that long, bright flame. The reflector concentrates the light into a spot beam. When the flame becomes dull or smokey, you blow it out, unscrew the two halves and dump the expended carbide on the mine floor. You refill with fresh carbide from your Prince Albert tobacco can (held enough for an 8 hour shift), refill the upper chamber with water (or pee) reassemble, relight and go back to work. Finding a good, clean miner's lamp is getting harder these days. There is a company in India that still makes them but the quality is not great. Personally, I'd love to have an Oxweld railroad inspection lamp.....they're WAY overbuilt and hold enough carbide/water for several hours. Why not just check over the Oxweld and play with it? It was designed for carbide. When your carbide arrives, try this: Fill a small saucer with water and drop one piece of carbide in it. It will instantly start to sizzle and produce gas. Hold a match over the saucer and it will ignite and burn for several minutes. Notice the black smoke it produces also. I've done this with my grandchildren to show them how "rocks" can burn......but I do it outside. PLEASE keep us up to date with your experiment. Frankly, I hope I'm wrong on everything I just typed and would love to see it work well for you. But still, be safe!
I just posted a long explanation of most of the above, plus some other concerns, in your original posting on another section of the forum. PLEASE read it, as I have a lot of experience playing with carbide miner's lamps along with some really dumb experiments as a kid. One of those experiments damn near cost me my eyesight and hearing........ Back in the mid sixties I attended our high school metal shop.........you know, back when schools taught something besides "racial equality". The teacher pulled a toy balloon over the tip of an oxy-acetylene torch and opened the acetylene valve only, filling the balloon. He then shut off the gas and passed a lit match under the balloon. The result was a mild "poof" accompanied by lots of sluggish, black smoke. He then replaced the balloon and filled it approximately 50-50 with acetylene and oxygen, then ignited it again. This time there was an ear splitting explosion that set off alarms all over the school. No joke! Students began exiting the building, accompanied by teachers trying to find out where the "bomb" had exploded. It got the point across though.......acetylene mixed with oxygen can make one Hell of an explosion. The slightest bit of air (oxygen) in that tank has the potential to ignite through the burner and create a fairly nasty bomb. If you really want to play with calcium carbide, put some in the Oxweld lantern, fill the upper chamber with water and turn on the water valve. Ignite it at the tip with a match and see what kind of flame it produces.......should be a long, skinny bright white flame which is regulated by how fast the water enters the lower chamber. That Oxweld lantern is a choice collector's item, extremely well built........and designed for carbide. If you continue with your experiment, please keep us all informed. I honestly hope it works for you, but again.....BE SAFE!
I'd assume you're building up a carbide lamp then, Bruce. Not a pressurized acetylene-air mantle lamp? A general carbide lamp flame (the usual brilliant yellow-white luminous flame) won't work with mantles. It'll soot the mantle up instead. To make it work in a gas mantle, you'd need to make the flame pale blue which, requires a different setup and the gas be somewhat pressurized like those from a gas torch with the Bernoulli principle in effect. This is where all the risks and concerns about pressurizing acetylene would be.
Thank you all for the safety tips-- I am processing all this information and making modifications before I actually try any lighting ~ as far as my water tank- I did put a pin hole in the lid - and the flow of gas is directed upward ~~ and as far as the mantle that will be the first try- but plan "B" will be to run the flame directly out of a Coleman 220 generator-and I will carefully grind of all the orifice threads except maybe one turn so in event of an explosion the orifice can pop off the stem~~~~ Balloon filled with o2 and acetylene--- I had a friend in college that would fill garbage bags with a long enough wick to get out of the way-- those would rattle windows ~~~~~~ this is what left of the lantern I showed in the video-- so I am pretty familiar with what can happen when a project goes south! , but thanks for all the helpful tips and wishes for my safety!! ( the brass tag on the box says " It seemed like a good idea at the time"--
I've tried the acetylene-air ballon bang as a teenager decades ago:- Strapped a ballon over the mouthpiece of a plastic bottle which, was the generator with calcium carbide and water bubbling inside it. After partially filling the balloon with acetylene, I carefully inserted a fish hose to introduce some air without letting out any of the gaseous contents. A bicycle pump was used for the air. The balloon was then fully inflated with acetylene-air mixture. Made a few of them to be placed together in a big bunch. As the delay device, a sheet of old newspaper inserted into bunch and lighted at the far end. That provided me enough time to escape to some 'safe' distance before the explosion. The bang was pretty tremendous and was without soot. I'd say the fuel-air ratio must have been ok(by chance). The experience was exhilarating.
Dammit Bobby, I mean Bruce; be careful brother. I’m going to need your Camp Wounded Dog expertise in the coming months.
Haven't we all? I actually did it quite recently, and I am not a kid anymore It is still fun with bangs and explosives, and sometimes it's just boring at work so you need to do something... But we used zip bags and electrical ignition. If you tune your oxy-acetylene welder to a god flame and use that setting to fill up a flat zip bag via what's left in one corner of the bag, you can shut that last corner immediatley after pulling the welder tip out. Then we just placed the bag on two electrodes that was connected to an oil boiler ignition transformer to be able to be on a safe distance when letting the bomb go off. Great fun!
Hopefully that won't be literally true and you don't get to meet your Maker before your allotted time...
I like the idea of electrical ignition.. Despite the known dangers, its sometimes in my mind to actually attempt initiating a 'pure' acetylene explosion without oxygen by means of sudden overpressure or some kind of explosive shock. Say, triggering a confined volume of pure acetylene that's just below 1.5 bar using a piece of firecracker in order to very quickly raise it beyond the self decomposition point. I've had a fair amount curious fun back in the day playing with the autoignition of acetylene in the presence of chlorine. Throw a piece of calcium carbide into a small container of hydrochloric acid or some strongly chlorine-type bleach and the produced gas would just self-ignite as it bubbles out of the liquid.
You mentioned about grinding threads? Might it be better to have a push-fit ? That way pressure cannot build at all?
