AIDA pressure lamps were manufactured after the war from around 1950 to 1972 by Petromax in the same factory in Altena/W-Germany.During this time, the AIDA's always made all structural changes analogous to the Petromax .This lamp is an AIDA 1350 with a "Sickentank ",identical to the Petromax 828 from the same period.This AIDA was manufactured in December 1955. (12/5) Reinhard
According to a former engineer form the Altena factory who was at the PX meeting in Menden only Petromax 500 lanterns where made in Altena.
@WimVe The only difference between 350cp and 500cp lamps in Petromax/AIDA is the jet and the needle. Surely the engineer also knows where the 250cp models were made ? Reinhard
Nice lantern. I have an Aida 1350 too. Its nearly identical to the Petromax 350/500cp from the same era, except for the stag logos, nameplate, shape of pricker wheel and the red colour scheme they used on it, the nameplate and the rapid preheater's lever. It is interesting on WimVe's statement about what the former engineer of the Altena factory said. Where else were the Petromaxes or Aidas made besides in Altena during that period?
I don't agree with that, you have to stamp a stag on a tank, besides the text AIDA. Then you have to again stamp the top reflector with another text, then you have other boxes, spare parts, sales channels etc. Technically you are right but in the whole picture it would have been another production line. Maybe, if there was more time to make a list of questions. The Petromax meeting in Menden was in 2002. Don't forget that the item we adore: the Petromax lantern was for the factory workers just an item they made. Graetz itself as a company was already going in another product direction. After production was stopped all what was left was literally thrown out of the windows in skips. The only question I asked him about other products, the donut lamps: he didn't know where they where made. Back to AIDA: personally I think they where made by Hipolito. But there was also a Graetz factory in Argentina. Who knows what they made there.
Hello Wim, attached a leaflet I found once in an archive in Germany. Do you really think that in 1951 the Graetz company already worked closed together with Hippolito in Portugal. I don't think so. According to my archive the partnership between the Graetz company and Hippolito did not start before 1974. I also do not believe that the AIDA Nr. 1250 was produced in Argentina and then sent to Germany. Kind regards Jörg
Dear Jörg, I don't think anything. I only write what people tell me or what I have seen. I don't write that I believe that AIDA's where made in Argentina, I write that there was a factory there and I don't know what they make there.
@WimVe My AIDA 1350 Was manufactured in Altena in December 1955.(Made in Germany plus tank scratching 12/5 ) After moving from Altena to Torres Vedras,AIDA,s were still produced sporadically. I've seen same from 1980 and 1984.I recognize these Portuguese AIDA,s immediately by the 4- digit number and"Germany" on the tank.I don't know whether AIDA,s were produced anywhere else in the world, but I don't think so.Reinhard
If not mistaken, I could recall reading somewhere that the Petromax 833(but not a donut type lantern) was allergedly made in Argentina. I don't think they made any Aida lamps there. No idea about them being ever made in Portugal. But my curiosity is more on: what about other sites in Germany besides Altena? Either the Petromax or the Aida, perhaps even both. Specifically between early 1950s till early 70s.
Hello MYN, I don't think that the Petromax 833 was ever built in Argentina. The No. 833 was a table lamp and it appeared first in the year 1921 and the last reference we do have is from 1927. Maybe you made a mistake with the number? The only factory which ever produced Petromax lanterns after the war was the one in Altena. In 1974 the Graetz company ceased the Petromax production in Germany. All machines where sent to Hipolito in Portgal. Kind regards Jörg
Petromax model 833 is listed in the 1958 Fanal Petromax catalogue and Juan has an example marked on the collar label with "Petromax Modelo No 833 Marca Registrada Industria Argentina" and stamped on the tank with "Petromax Industria Argentina". This strongly suggests to me it was made in the Petromax factory which Hr Steden helped to set up in the early 1950s. ::Neil::
Hello together, i got curious and made a google search: The number "833" is the same, but the pre war (German) and after war (Argentinian) lanterns seem to be quite different. For example see Petromax 833 made in Argentina / Argentinien The one in the advertising is the German one, the pictures are the Argentinian one. Regards, Steven
Yes @Jörg Wekenmann The Argentinian Petromax 833 was what I came across earlier like those shown in Steven's posted pictures. The one with a white enamelled cap. With some hinted evidence as mentioned in Neil's post. The suggestion was pretty strong. That particular Petromax 833 lantern was not likely made in Germany. The collar/frame also seems to have the older oblong-slotted design as the pre-war German Petromaxes.
I was only curious on what's in WimVe's post about what the ex-engineer said that only 500cp units were produced in Altena. There certainly had been others(200, 350cp) being made in Germany during that time. Where would those be made then?
Hello MYN, thank you for your two responses. I've checked my archive again and there is absolutely no proof visible that there ever existed another plant than the one in Altena. All leaflets, catalogues, or trademarks with an address on it show only the Altena address. The former engineer was asked to this matter 28 years after Graetz had ceased the Petromax production in Altena. Due to other interrogation I have made in the past with eye witness I'm more than carefully with their statements. If I can find one or better two other eyewitness who confirms me the same story the first one told me I do belief it. If I can't find another eyewitness or I do get another statement I deal these statements with great care. Kind regards Jörg
Thank you Jörg. I have not heard of another plant for the production of the Petromax lantern in Germany during the period from the 1950s till perhaps the early 70s, besides the one located in Altena. Neither have I come across any records or evidence that might lead me to believe otherwise. Nevertheless, I'm still open to any speculations or hints about the possibilities that such a subsidiary plant(s) might have existed during that particular period. That's especially with the understanding that Graetz were already focussing mainly on the manufacture of electronics and other telecommunication devices as their core business. It might just be a little interesting or even questionable that a sole plant in Altena could have such capacity and setup to account for the production of both the Petromax and Aida lamps in addition to their main products.
Hello MYN, when Graetz sold his company to the SEL AG they have had plants in 13 different cities all over West Germany. There they produced Radios, TV an many other items. To produce two different label at the same time or short after another would not have been a problem for the Graetz KG in Altena. Kind regards Jörg
Hello MYN, on the above mentioned Homepage from Torsten Scherning we can find some other very interesting information: Petromax 826 from Argentina / Argentinien "There was a commercial agency in downtown Buenos Aires. Because of the much poorer electrification, Petromax was an important thing, similar to what it is today in India. The name says it all. All lamps are called Petromax, whether it is one or not. Sales were organized through Buenos Aires. Peru, Bolivia, Chile etc. Some lamps were imported, some made here. Petromax Baby, for example, was imported. The business started here around 1935. The 826 was the beginning. It was manufactured with various modifications until 1950. Then it became the 833. These lamps were then no longer bright nickel-plated, but chrome-plated. After 1965 the business was given up and the know-how went to the Aurora company, but that is no longer Petromax quality. They're beautiful lamps too. " Yesterday Reinhard has sent me some photos of his Argentine Petromax lamp. Reinhard wrote me that this lamp has nothing common with the after war lamps from Graetz. Kind regards Jörg
Thank you for the information. Yes, I can see there are marked differences between the Argentinian unit and the post-war Petromaxes by Graetz. Its great to know that there indeed had been some other production sites(post war) in Germany besides Altena. Are there any records which might indicate that they belonged to the Graetzs? Or were they always referenced to the main address in Altena only?
Very interesting discussion. So if I got it right Altena was the only place in post war Germany to produce pressure lamps of the brands Petromax, Aida and Standard, the third not yet mentioned production line. And no reduction on only 500 cp lamps, but the whole range. Matthias
I have here an original AIDA operating manual from 2/59.Back then in the 50s to the early 60s the lanterns at Petromax/AIDA were drawn exactly as the looked at the time. It is an AIDA with a smooth carrying frame.It's an AIDA like the one @MYN shows in the reference gallery .Altough the corrugated frame already existed at the time,It was obviously not used on all types . @LatMag49 Petromax and AIDA used four different carrying frames from around 1950 to 1972. On the Standard lanterns from this time (6102;6112,6122) you can only find 2 different support frames .The bead support frame and the smooth support frame were not used on Standard lanterns.Standard also has another preheater. (Momento).The relationship between Petromax and Standard was obviously not as close as the relationship between Petromax and AIDA. @WimVe Petromax's connections with Hipolito go back further ,to at least 1950,maybe even further.And wenn you couldn't produce in Altena ,you could have had a series produced by order by Hipolito or FAMA.You should't exclude anything that might be possible . Reinhard
Honestly, I'd still be a little doubtful that all the post war Petromaxes and Aidas had been produced solely in the Altena plant throughout the two decades. I'd say the quantity was pretty immense for export to the rest of the World. The units by Hipolito in Portugal are generally regarded as the ones to bear the closest resemblance to the German Petromax in terms of features and quality. Therefore, I won't be surprised if some units had actually been produced there as well. Nevertheless, I'm more inclined to take the possibility that they could also be produced elsewhere in West Germany besides Altena.
Hello Matthias, there is something wrong with your statement that: So, if I got it right Altena was the only place in post war Germany to produce pressure lamps of the brands Petromax, Aida and Standard, the third not yet mentioned production line. The Standard Licht GmbH company never belonged to the Graetz AG or later to the Graetz KG. Standard was an independent company which was closed at 31.01. 1976 (excerpt from the commercial register Frankfurt in my archive) The Standard Licht GmbH and the Schweizer Lampen- und Metallwaren AG, Zürich worked close together. As well as in the pre-war time but also after the war the general manger and owner of both companies was the same Mr. Gustav Ulmann from Zürich. In the 1930ties Mr Uhlmann has had two different contacts with Graetz company concerning the production of lamps for Graetz as well as Graetz produced pressure lamps for the Standard company. Last year I published this on the Hytta Forum in Germany. Kind regards Jörg
@WimVe Which lamp are you specifically interested in? AIDA 1250(MD41) Do you have detailed photos of the lamp? Even from the tank without a carrying frame. Also from below. Reinhard
@Jörg Wekenmann I know that Graetz was not the owner of the Standard brand, but I thought the Petromax like Standard lamps were made in Altena by order of the brand owner. The two I have are stamped Made in Germany, that's why I spoke of three production lines. Matthias
Reinhard, thanks for the offer but I only wrote what was told to me: no AIDA lamps where made in Altena. I guess without more evidence, like Jörg wriites, we will not know. The leaflet tells us they where made and sold in 1951 but not where they where manufactured.
Hello Wim, how many plants has had the Graetz KG at that time? Three! All situated in Altena. Kind regards Jörg
