Dears, Recently I was trying to find some good and cheaper substitution for Caswell epoxy resign tank sealer. I think I have got it finally – Epsidian 5 epoxy resign, made in Poland. I had to make several phone calls to epoxy resign distributors and asked for best solution for my purposes. In Poland it costs here approx. 15$ for 560g including “Z1” hardener. I just used it yesterday – it has thick consistency, very sticky, cure quite fast. It is solvent free and according to producer data immune to most chemicals including petrol and short time temperature up to +80C . Please find attached some data sheets (Polish language) and some brief summary below: A liquid, unmodified, low-molecular-weight epoxy resin obtained from bisphenol A and epichlorohydrin, commercially known as Epidian® 5. Other identification methods: 2,2'-[(1-methyl-ethylidene)bis(4,1-phenylene-oxymethylene)]bisoxirane. EPIDIAN®5 is used for the production of: chemically resistant paints and coatings, binders for epoxy-glass laminates, compound for casting in electrical engineering, flooring compositions, putties, impregnating agents, cold curing adhesives for metals, glass, and ceramics. The resin has the form of a sticky liquid with an amber color and is characterized by: minimal shrinkage during curing, the ability to cure at room temperature, excellent adhesion to most materials such as metals, glass, ceramics, wood etc., good mechanical properties and resistance to the action of many chemical agents such as oils, greases, diluted alkalis and acids, resistance to short-term exposure to temperatures up to 80°C, and excellent dielectric properties. It is soluble in acetone. CHEMICAL RESISTANCE/ODPORNOŚĆ CHEMICZNA according to the table below is also included in attached files and can be easily translated. Well, so most likely there are also other alternatives made in other countries and we do not have to spend hell a lot of money just for the best known products and shipping costs from abroad. Exposure Time – 1 month/1 miesiąc "+" – very good immunity/odporność bardzo dobra Benzyna = petrol/gasoline/benzine Naphtha/kerosene is not listed here, but I believe that petrol is more aggressive. @MYN all the best, Piotrek
Congratulations for finding an alternative in your location. Caswell is quite expensive as commented by many around the World. Is the Ciech Sardyna Epsidian 5 available from any shops in Poland? Maybe only in special shops? I think it appears like a product for Industrial users. Which lanterns did you apply the product on?
Hi @MYN That resin is available in many shops online in Poland and in different capacities. I am still "fighting" with my remaining three HASAG 102 with very rusty steel tanks. After some cleaning and derusting (Evaporust and APP R-Stop) I applied that epoxy to cover these tanks from inside - approx. 30g for each. I just want to protect these tanks from rusting even worse and enforce these tanks with thick epoxy layer. Fettling progress is very slow due to plenty of problems and lack of motivation for doing several lamps of one type at the same time. Especially that I fettled one more HASAG 102 just before these three. To have some fun I even "smeared" epoxy from outside on one tank just to check how it looks like It looks like old rusty but glossy tank now Well, I would not do it again, but it was such a crappy tank that it was ok to make some experiments on it. After my experiment I was going to clean that tank from outside with acetone, but I will leave that epoxy cover just as it is. Once I finish these lamps I will post and report my "adventures". all the best, Piotrek
I just noted that I made a typo in the thread subject - this is Epidian 5 not Epsidian 5. Anyway - it is worth to try in my opinion.
It is nice to explore possibilities other than the usual fettle routines. Hasag 102s, in my opinion, have a very appealing shape/form/look. Something like a Nulite Model 5 lantern but with a single mantle/burner. It is good to have all the necessary datasheets on the Epidian 5. When uncured or partially-cured, you can still easily remove with acetone. Fully-cured epoxies are very difficult to remove. Even acetone will take quite a long while to disintegrate it. The only commonly available chemical I know which would remove cured epoxies faster is methylene chloride (dichloromethane), found in some paint strippers. One thing you might want investigate further though: I noticed that you had applied the App R-Stop anticorrosion product prior to application ofthe Epidian 5. App R-Stop is based on certain moisture-assisted urethane/polyurethane chemistry. They are compatible with subsequent polyester-based primers and coatings. From what I know, epoxies don't bond very well over urethane or polyurethane coated surfaces. They might not adhere very well on urethane/polyurethane surfaces. They adhere best on bare, cleaned, slightly etched or roughened steel surfaces. I'm not entirely sure if Epidian 5 would be compatible with App R-Stop, but from my basic knowledge on the chemistries involved, I suspect they might not be. It would be better for you to check again on that.
Thank you @MYN for your comments. I was super exited about HASAG 102 when I located the first and the second one. Less with others. I was devastated once discovered that the most reliable part of HASAG 102 tank is the plating (nickel or chromium). Plating is super quality, but they neglected rust protection from inside and these lamps may look good from outside and are full of rusty holes inside. Very tricky and sometimes quite expensive... Hopefully out of 5 lamps I will make 4. One is ready. Three in progress. I can not get rid of rust completely (several days in citric acid solution) and brush it with wire brush from outside because most likely plenty of holes would appear. That is how I make a sieve from my first lamp. Patching the steel tank help needed So this time is Evaporust, gentle cleaning, APP R-STOP and epoxy to enforce tanks and avoid holes. All tanks were painted with small brush with R-STOP from outside as well. This is almost translucent and liquid chemical. Sticks very well to surface and protects from rust. Leaves a bit glossy/oily visual effect on the surface, but I like it and visually it is really hard to recognise if tank was covered with R-STOP or not. Any puddle of R-STOP inside the tanks sticks very vell to bottom/walls and after several weeks creates very hard layer. That R-STOP layer seems to be very chemical resistant (as far as I remember I was not able to clean old, dry R-STOP it with Acetone), so I think it is beneficial for enforcing tanks integrity, To keep all these shitty rusty remains in place strong and stable. You are right - epoxy does not stick to smooth plated and R-STOP covered surfaces as good as to rough ones, but this epoxy is really thick and very sticky - according to my observations and according to parameters provided by the producer. Problem with epoxy cover over R-STOP You can observe on the bottom of the glossy tank - picture attached. But that was very thin layer of epoxy smeared with my finger over the tank. I was trying to create just very thin epoxy cover using my finger pressed against the tank and covering epoxy over the surface. From inside it looks good, because there was thick epoxy cover spreading by itself gravitationally when I was rotating slowly tanks. Visibility of tanks from inside is obviously limited, but I can see that there is thick, glossy epoxy layer inside. I may add another epoxy layer (approx. 30g/tank again) inside to enforce tanks even more. I am pretty sure that these tanks will keep the pressure even now, but since I have plenty of cheap, good epoxy, so maybe I will do it again, why not? Would you recommend to add that second epoxy layer as soon as possible or wait till the first epoxy layer is fully cured (two weeks)? I will leave that glossy tank just as a reminder of my efforts and in reality it looks quite ok (except for the bottom ).
Even with the thickest and toughest rust, the citric acid should be able to eventually remove all down to the deepest pits and crevices. Also, it depends whether you made it concentrated enough. Earlier, I have personally made a nearly saturated (super-concentrated) citric acid solution for derusting purpose. I had plenty of citric acid crystals then. I added the crystals into the solution until they would no longer dissolve. When the acid so concentrated, it would hardly attack the metal.(a self-inhibitory effect). It would only attack the rust and other oxidation. The chemistry of App R-Stop is similar to POR-15, except it is thinner/less viscous. Single pack, moisture-curing urethane. I have checked the App R-Stop's TDS(attached). I guess you are fortunate. On pages 2 and 3, there is mention about being suitable for coating with epoxy products and primers. Since the Epidian 5 is a solvent-free epoxy, you can apply immediately or as soon as possible, before the first layer fully cures. This way, it adheres better to the first layer. **Only for products that contain solvents, you would need to wait until all solvents(from deeper within the layer) have fully evaporated off before applying a subsequent layer. Otherwise, you'd tend to get bubbles and delamination. Actually, you need not apply it too thickly. In general, thicker coatings have higher tendencies to peel off more easily than thinner ones. It is a balance between the epoxy's adhesive force on the App R-Stop coated steel and the cohesive force within the epoxy layer itself. Epoxies inherently have very high cohesiveness, and therefore contributing to its high strength and toughness. In view of this, it would be wise to ensure that its own cohesiveness does not greatly outweight its adhesive or sticking force on the App R-Stop surface. The thicker the epoxy layer, the greater the ratio of cohesive strength within itself to its adhesive strength on the substrate(App R-Stop coated steel).
