I for one voted OUT, and was disgusted by the inaccuracies made in claims by both sides of the debate in their campaigns. Having been born in an age before we joined the EEC, and having had a Grandfather and Father who fought in two World wars respectfully to retain a degree of freedom from Empire builders (yes, I know we built one ourselves and where's that now?), the European Union is another Empire intent of the eradication of democracy and National identity. A little history in 41 minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0WeURiShfU Our future within the EU would see the disappearance of Britain. We would eventually have had to adopt the Euro as a single currency. To say all our laws would have come from Brussels would be pointless - because they already do - rubber stamped by Westminster. Though it is also fair to say that many of the laws pertaining to come from the EU are actually being rubber stamped by them - they having come from Global organisations such as UNECE which creates Global standards on goods and foodstuffs. Had the leave campaign stuck to the truth and not had coco the clown and big mouth performing, I would suggest the OUT votes would have been much higher. Had the remain campaign laid out their plans for Britain's future within the EU as being influential in changing its policies from dictatorial to democratic, some may have actually believed them. But the core truth about the EU - and a core truth about why remain did not declare that Cameron's changes could be made - is that the EU is unchangeable by any nation state. It is the primary Nation State that dictates all from an unelected politburo - unelected and un-removable by the people. In remaining, our nation would subjugate all decisions and responsibilities away from the UK to Brussels (It mostly has already). And the reason why so many of our Ministers, MP's, and MEP's were/are for remain, is because they are on a cushy number, with all the grants, favours and protection from the EU, while not actually having to do very much themselves in terms of actual work. The EU is corrupt to the core. Whistleblower auditors have been sacked when approaching commissioners with books that do not balance. It is the Tower of Babel of Europe - you can look on in awe, but you can't go in. So far have we been integrated into its system; so many decades have we been fed lies and been misled by those who took us in, and would wish us to stay in, quoting the many different funding arrangements we have received and how we are "stronger in", that the damage has been done. We have been in a straight-jacket that in 1972 was a loose fit, but as each treaty has been signed by our Ministers, the ties have been tightened to the effect that we no longer have the experience of free movement, and just like a plaster cast being removed from a limb, we are going to have to learn how to use that freedom once again - we are going to need physio - democratic physio. It's going to hurt for a while, but with regular exercise, and with help from trading countries we will become strong again. Quite why there are so many people bitter about leaving defies logic. What we received from the EU in terms of monies are a fraction of what was paid to them in the first place by us. What trades we do with the EU will continue. Why so many are spitting venom and bile at having been outvoted by a small majority - is senseless and destructive. We have a future to build - help build it, for the sake of generations to come. The EU construct is crumbling, much to the annoyance of its architects and surveyors as the UK is part of its bedrock, and so bitter are they at our vote to leave, they are attempting to make an example of us as what not to do so other countries will be dissuaded from following suit. Is this the kind of political structure we wish to remain in? Or is it playground bullying tactics? Rumour now has it that Germany wants their own referendum, France may also, and certain Eastern block members are questioning their position. Government is in a mess. Leave has failed to adopt, and proffer a structured plan to follow following a referendum leave vote - despite being offered one - so much noise, no structure - though such a plan has been downloaded many tens of thousands of times, including by civil servants in Whitehall, and this is it: Flexcit With regard to Scotland; It was put forward that Sturgeon would be scotched (an apt verb?) by the Spanish a while back. Scotland is still part of the Union, to apply for joining the EU would require the start of negotiations as if requiring entry in the first instance. Any country could veto that request, and Spain would be up to do just that. [strike]Groper[/strike] Juncker embracing Sturgeon? Bet she was glad when that was over. Little Lichtenstein operates Article 112 to limit the number of immigrants, and also has access to the so called single market. Whilst the UK is much larger, we may have fulfilled our quota and some, but the principle remains. However, it's all down to negotiations. These are interesting and historic times. But just for fun - one American judge has her forceful say. Hang on to your hats: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qucpMcLtRL8
Thanks for adding the quote, Claus - it's the only part of your post that makes any sense! So next time, please write in Danish - it'll be quicker and easier for you and make just as much sense to me (and I won't know when you're being rude...)
This is the corruptionindeks: http://www.transparency.org/cpi2015 Scroll down and click your country to see the result. Usefull and handy, if the author wasnt paid off. Claus C
Still raining over here, though more of a dribble. Yesterday eve we had a real downpour! And there's more to come they say.........
The index says higly corrupt Or did you make some sort of a joke By the way a former exploited country. There you see politician disgust in full scale Claus C
Derek mentions Scotland, as they were overruled, and to me that is a problem. What could be a even bigger problem is North Ireland. When I was a little girl there was armed English guards, concrete and fence at the border. That disappeared when UK and Eire went in the EU together. Would you put back the fence/guards seperating these 2 country-parts from each other?. That I wouldnt consider as a leap forward or in Danish requested by David: Jeg tror nogen har drukket af lokummet og løjet for jer . Claus C
On a side note (I'll not comment on the Brexit), Australia has compulsory voting for Federal and State Parliaments, and for Referenda. It may seem perculiar, but it is very "enfranchising" - it certainly stimulated my children to get interested and involved in discussing political choices and their implications from an early age. One of the biggest threat to democracy is cynicism... Tony
Now you're just taking the p!ss, Claus... How does that work, Tony - do you get fined or something? What happens if you deliberately spoil your ballot paper?
Here is another angle - but these people wont succeed https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37iHSwA1SwE Claus C
David Yes, there are fines for failure to vote without a good reason; and also for failure to register. As voting is secret, there is no offence for casting an informal vote (that is one that cannot be counted for whatever reason -blank, illegible, meaningless...). So technically there is no reason to not be creative on the ballot paper and draw caricatures of your favourite politician etc - but it could result in being challenged. As long as your voting intentions are clear, they will be counted. So a picture of a horses @#$% on a ballot paper does not necessarily make it invalid. It may be challenged by a scrutineer, but the final decision on its validity would be with the returning office (or the courts). Note: In Federal Parliamentary elections and most State elections, voting is preferential - not "first past the post". Therefore there is a minimum number of boxes which have to be numbered from 1 to n in order for the vote to be valid (there are certain 'savings' provisions in the electoral act which may mean that some ballot papers with fewer than the required number of boxes filled may still be counted as valid). The order of your numbers determines the order in which your preferences are distributed. Being a pedantic old bastard, and a political tragic, I always distribute all of my preferences. That is, even if there are 106 candidates I will put my least preferred option at 106 and my most at 1 and then fill the rest in in order of preference. It makes going to the polling booth an event rather than a chore! Cheers Tony
.... Ha ha ha... what's the matter?... Did your tea go cold?... ...Makes me laugh when you talk about corruption in the E.U. when the chancellor was caught on a yacht with Peter Mandelson and a Russian oligarch (before he was chancellor).... ... Do you seriously trust Any polititian ? ... It's a joke, and not a very good one... On us as usual...
The 'Yes Minister' clips can often portray seemingly hidden truths, and we all like a laugh at politicians expense - but in the real world the cost is born by the tax payers. What the clip portrays in 'working it from the inside', has not, and does not work in reality. This much is proven - certainly from Britain's point of view. Things are moving on. Take particular note of the italicised sections from this post. They are quotes from the banking world of 1924: http://www.britishconstitutiongroup.com/sites/default/files/documents/Divided%20Nation.pdf For an overview of what is happening in Europe and the USA right now, Greer puts it down very well in his 'Hall of Mirrors' blog post: (Interestingly this highlights the attacks between individuals on opposing sides as part of the 'greater' plan. Divide and conquer.) http://thearchdruidreport.blogspot.co.uk/2016/06/outside-hall-of-mirrors.html Nicola Sturgeon: https://semipartisansam.com/2016/06/28/eu-referendum-live-blog-aftermath/
Interesting comments from a financial expert: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPtT3tJjiAA This is an interview with Patrick Young on Russia Today, the day after the vote.
We danes reallhy start to like Boris Johnsson. He is just like our former member of the parlament Jacob Haugaard. We are closer to each other, danes and brites, than you imagine in the first place https://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Haugaard and in poorly translated English: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Haugaard Press translate if interested Claus C
As Tony has indicated Australia has compulsory voting. All of voting age must register and must vote on pain of a fine. That of course only gets the voters to the polling both, who knows how they mark their voting papers! Cheers Peter
Yes, compulsory voting is only beneficial when there's some sort of proportional representation system in place. There's little point to it when it's a Constituency-based 'first past the post' system, such as we have here in the UK. In north-east England which has/had a history of heavy industry, people tend to vote as their parents, grandparents and even great-grandparents did and that is for the Labour Party. Non-political elections such as for Parish Councillors and Police Crime Commissioner become politicised. Around here, you could put a red rosette on a dog-*ur* and people would vote for it and elect it. So:- If I vote for the Labour Party, they get elected; If I vote for the Conservative Party, Labour get elected; If I vote for any of the other Parties, Labour get elected; If I spoil my ballot paper, Labour get elected; If I don't bother to vote, Labour get elected. So what's the point of voting? - beats me...
Here in Tasmania we have, for our State elections, a further enhancement of proportional representation. We have 5 multi-member seats (5 members for each seat), elected through the Hare-Clark method of counting votes: http://www.abc.net.au/elections/tas/2006/guide/hareclark.htm The result is that the Parliament is more likely to have representatives from minor parties - and it is more difficult to win all the seats needed to form a majority Government (we do have a one party majority Government at the moment). Cheers Tony
So nearly a year on from that vote, where are we now? The push towards a unification referendum in Ireland is gaining momentum concerning the northern six counties, The Scottish government are due to call a new independence referendum, hard expulsion...soft expulsion....what will happen?
We are in the period of 'The Phoney war', where no-one knows for certain what is coming next; no-one is preparing; and everyone is asking "what's happening?" Will we ever know, given the dross that the main stream media pour out and the deceit and secrecy that governments are apt to covet. But whatever hits the fan, we'll know what it is when it hits us. Brexit: the phony war continues
It's nice to see some cerebral political discourse. With out name calling ,yelling or childish rants,even if it's on a lamp forum....but consider having someone like Trump running"The show".......that will make you laugh and cry at the same time!!!. Just my 2 cents from the other side of the pond.
