Altered 227K, 327K or 427K

I have what I believe is a Canadian 220 April 1929. But I am not sure as I am not a collector and the lamp belonged to my Dad when we had a farm. Is it worth doing something with? I dont know. Its the one on the right. Any info would be great about this lamp or even the othera 237

 

Both well worth getting going.toad
Both are kero and parts would not be to much trouble,good luck.

 

Welcome
There are a few of us lurking around here from Aus who would be glad to help you get them running if that is your desire . what area are you located.

 

@neil mackay

Both are nice lanterns, and as @Graham P said, we’d be happy to help you get them going.

Cheers

Tony

 

Welcome aboard!
Those lanterns are both well worth restoring.

 

One on right looks like a possible Coleman L227. Having said that it appears someone did some swapping of parts. Looks like they tried to turned it into a kerosene lantern. Anyway, both appear to be worth restoring! Nice

 

Ok RH one isn’t a L227 as the date is too early I would say someone has swapped out the vent at some point . Also top part of frame and supports are missing Its a gas (shellite) model and not kerosene as it’s been fitted with a preheat cup which could add confusion as kerosene models are fitted with these .
It wouldn’t be hard to find the right cage and vent to make it right as it’s actually a 427
The other is a 237 I’d be interested to see the date on the fount as early ones have been found here

 

L227 is first listed in the shiping record in August 1927 so a 1929 example is very possible. Coleman were selling Kero lamps from 1928 although mostly for export and we don't know what these models 221 and 222 looked like . If it was originally made as a kero lantern that would make the lamp model KL227 or K227 but it could also be 221 or 222. What we REALLY don't know is what Canada were making at the time. They did make some product that was slightly different to Wichita and who knows maybe they did make an LK227.

I have no information that suggests Coleman ever made a K227 and maybe this is an L227 which has been converted to kero. Either way it is still a pretty rare thing because L227 is not at all a common find. Certainly at the time Coleman were making K327 and K427 so the basics were there and it would be logical for them to have made the wide hat version K227. I have nothing that confirms they did and I should have so maybe this has been "converted" at some time. ::Neil::

 

Mackburner, Many thanks for the info. As to the one on the right I have some anecdotal evidence that when it was purchased it had Mica as shield/glass fitted to it and it was a '1920's model' other than that I have little further info. But susp[ect it has been modified at some stage as the wide hat seems to be suspect.
Which now puts me in a quandary as to how to ID it, then where to find the parts etc. Whilst I have been a collector of many things Coleman lamps have never been on the horizon.

 

Akeepsake, I am not sure where the 'fount' is, do you have an image or drawing of the fount.

 

@neil mackay

“Fount” is posh talk for the tank fuel tank.

Tony

 

Neil
I don’t think Canada followed suit on L227 US production dates and were later in commencement of manufacturing
Two earliest verified Canadian L227s are dated 1-32 and the other handful are all dated 1934
Because this has the cage top missing I would be almost certain the big hat vent was an addition later
427Ks and 327Ks weren’t manufactured till 35 so I doubt at all the possibilities of this being an original kero burner
I’d like to see the burner assy

 

Maybe they didn't but there are two models we can't ID correctly models 221 and 222 were kero lanterns made around 1928 ish marked as for export in Hiram's list. Now whilst we don't know what they looked like in 1928 I would assume they made a mod for their standard types which were 327 and 427. Were they export kero versions then of one with a pump and one without or did they both have pumps and there are two different hoods making one of them a 227K? Canada did most of the export stuff so did Canada take over the supply of these two models in 1929 and they are in fact the 327K and 427K or 227K? I don't know but the posibilty remains. You may be right and this may be an aftermarket hybrid but we know little about Coleman Kero from the late 1920s so we have to be open minded here and just maybe this is an example of a previously unidentified model. ::Neil::

 

Is this what you want?

 

... and the other side of the burner would be good.

Cheers

Tony

 

Yes Neil I totally agree about odd Canadian especially here in Australia !
By the looks of the burner pic it has the restrictor fitted and isn’t the normal L227 type burner assy
Not being home I can’t compare but suspect this may be a lamp burner assy ? Definitely not a 327K or 427K as I compared to pics of mine
Still suspect a Frankie but I’d love to be wrong

 

Neil is there any writing on the burner tube below where your photo stops ?
A patent date etc?

 

As this is some years older than 327K and 427K it is perhaps reasonable that the burner is different. It is certainly a 20s burner casting type and lamp or lantern? Who knows but if this is a 1929 kero lantern then it's one we have never seen before so we can't say the burner is wrong. What we do know is it's a kero burner with the restrictor in the air tube and for 1929 that is very early and something we have not seen before at that date. The missing upper globe cage is a worry perhaps but somewhere back in the lamps history it was removed. Wouldn't need to do that to fit the wider hood though but of course the bail might have been a problem and we will never know since there is no bail here.

If we stop and think about this some logic might help. There are two kero lantern models, 221 and 222, which were exports and advertised in Malaysia in the late 1920s. We have no details and don't know what they look like. Here we have a kero lantern from the late 20s which was an export for sure, given where it was found, and it doesn't fit any lamp model we know of. Two matching sets of facts suggest maybe they are the same thing.

Sooner or later one of these unknown kero lanterns could surface and when it does the only thing we will know is that it will in some way be different to anything we are familiar with and it won't fit but it will be a kero lantern and look like a Coleman from the late 1920s. Hybrid aftermarket fettle maybe but I kinda lean towards it being maybe a model 222. ::Neil::

 

Interesting stuff Neil Ill have to do my homework on those elusive models It’s hard when there is no visual reference and until then it’s anyone’s guess Definitely peaked my interest and I’ll have to keep my eyes peeled !

 

Hi
interesting thread
can i see the other side of the burner cast please?

 

Does it look like this?

1935 427K Canada

 

heres the other side, not like the Canadian one. No patent numbers, no markings what so ever.

 

Thanks Neil Personally I think it’s a made up lantern Until we find the elusive 221 and 222 we will never know because the cage is missing and the pump looks added
Do you have a date on the fount for the 237 It will be a letter on one side and date on the other eg A-39
Thanks

 

The only thing stamped on the fount is two numbers 4 and 29 no letter anywhere that I could see. If you go to my earlier posts you will see the image of the fount and the numbers

 

I mean the other lantern . The one on the left

 

ok, tomorrow will put up the images

 

Here you go, no letters only numbers must be a Canadian thing.

 

Thanks Neil

no patent would be correct for a mid 30s 40s airtube

Seems to me your 1929 lantern was previously a 327 and somebody added the pump.
So far i thinks its been assembled with different parts from different models.

 

1949 Canadian 237 Empire

 

With this knowledge, it would affect the likelihood of refurbishing them, although it wasnt high on my agenda. I appreciate your efforts to assist, thanks. Neil