The youngest of my lantern collection. Red Tilley, x246b 1977. From the collection I got in December last year. I have two x246b's, the other one shown in my previous thread. Red's short term destiny is to go with us on an outback qld camping trip this Winter. So the before and after pics show I've derusted the chrome cage and given her a cleanup. In fact, I've ended up making the paint a bit more patchy just from removing the grime with soapy water. But it would be silly to do a repaint when Red's about to be knocked around a bit, if not by the kids, the corrugations. As well as the de-rusting, Red has had a tank flush, vaporiser and pricker needle attention, and all new seals and leather. I've grown fond of Red during testing. For some reason this is the brightest burning Tilley I have (up and running) so far, despite being quite rough around the edges in various ways. Secondly we share the same birth year!! As bought: After initial attention:
@Pauly where did you get the new Vapouriser please? I have one fewer than I need but it's a difficult choice to know what to buy. In the ideal world I would like an unused old one, but what I can buy easily is a modern one except I have been there before. Then there are the "compatibles" from various countries, either copies or with design improvements. If I had a machine shop I could make one my way, but I don't. What is your's please?
Hi @JonD , the vapouriser came on the lantern. If it is a new one it would be the previous owner. When I said I gave it attention it was simply heat quench cycling and cleaning the carbon off the rod.
Ah yes - I see. If you have the time and inclination it would be great to see a picture of the top end of it please. There are a few different incarnations of vapouriser and I am curious which one you have. I have a 1964 and a 1973 - which both had the same vapouriser judged by looking at the top end. Later on changes came along to the Tilley genuine parts (not all good in my reckoning) and these are the ones you can still buy today. I have used some but they did not last. There are also some copies and some claimed improved versions from different vendors in various countries. Very hard to know where to put your money. I'm holding off. I haven't yet abandoned the search for turning the not much loved X246B into a usable lamp. It has many failings which are dwelt upon here. I think the tank is adequate - not as good as what went before I admit. I think it will run brightly on 10-20 pumps if all is well. So what need to pump any more? I do think the burner might be too small to cool the vapouriser in some circumstances so sometimes they swell up due to overheating of the side walls. Some say carbon build up causes that. Not in my dissections - melted. I have one vapouriser just now and it's being swapped between the '64 and the '73..and working very well. But I need another one..
Hi @JonD , I've just done a load of pics of the vaporiser. I'd be interested in your observations about the various changes to the vaporisers over the years. Note also in relation to this lantern burning the brightest, one thing that maybe could make some difference is that I threw the oldest looking mantle I had onto it to test it - it was yellowed and looked almost like plastic - as I was placing it on there were dust particles coming off it... I wonder how much the mantle might have to do with brightness. Anyway here goes.
@Pauly & @JonD That looks like a pre-“the current version” of the Tillley vapouriser and is probably consistent with the manufacture date of the lantern. Tony
@Pauly & @Tony Press yes I certainly agree. That is the type I am looking for. Both mine had that type when I acquired them but various accidents have meant they are no longer serviceable. Later ones had a welded seam at the top which means the ledge for the burner to sit on is rounded and quite often there are ripples in the welding. I just have a hunch that contact area at that point matters so that the burner can conduct heat away from the top of the vapouriser tube which is right in the flame blast inside the mantle. This second type has much less contact area. Interesting point about the old mantle. I wonder if you know anyone who has access to a geiger counter? Maybe it is one of the old radioactive types? These were rumoured to be brighter but I have no experience.
@JonD Old mantles: There is a huge amount of complete sh!te said about “old mantles”. 1. Yes, it is true that old mantles were “radioactive”, infused with Thorium. But they were also extremely well made. 2. Some modern mantles are made with Yttrium, and they are not so well made. 3. Some modern mantles do not have either. I’ve burnt though a lot of mantles. My opinion is that it is the construction of the mantle (weave and weft) rather than “radioactivity”, combined with a well fettled lantern, that determines brightness. Cheers Tony
Wow I had no idea that there was this whole thing about old mantles. Had I known that I would have taken some photos before I took it out of its strange old brittle plastic packet. It definitely looked very different from the other mantles I have.
So just a brief update. Over the last two weeks we covered about 3,500 kms (2200 miles), return trip Brisbane up to Cairns up the coast then back down the inland outback route with red in the back of our Toyota Prado, camper trailer in tow, and parents with caravan. I had a cracked glass that I put on Red for the trip (a complete vertical crack from top to bottom) as I knew all our gear was in for a beating. I just had it wrapped in a towel in the back. While mostly sealed road we did enough nasty corrugated hours to/from some remote places for my parents to crack a water pipe on their caravan and lose all their water, also for us to realise at the end of one of the days our toyota hitch pin clip (on a chain) had been ejected from the hitch pin (must have been rocks), and my parents van also lost lights due to an electrical fault we tracked down and fixed (again rough road related). Over the trip we actually relied on Red to light up when we had lack of other lights for a couple of nights (bit of a story there too), but also for generally lighting up the campsite. Funny how this is the second time I've had a Tilley on hand and it has saved the night!!! The only problem I had was I needed to replace the mantle after the first day of corrugated road. The second mantle held up to the rest of the trip.
For rough roads you might consider lacquering the mantles. Cheap and nasty firm hold hair spray is best. Just soak the mantles well and this will give them a strength to withstand rough handling. The lacquer will flash burn off when you preheat and will not damage the mantle. ::Neil::
I have had lacquered mantles survive postage overseas. Not all of them but I reckon around 75% survival. Works well with two tie mantles and a lacquered Tilley mantle stands a lot of rough handling. ::Neil::
@Pauly Be careful not to get too close to the mantle with the pressurised spray or you can blow a hole in the mantle. Cheers Tony
Hey guys, I've been a bit quiet but on Christmas hols now and fettling again. So "Red" is no longer red right now. Used a paint stripper (citristrip) which I believe is quite gentle as I wanted to take all the paint off before repainting the fount. I found it really interesting that underneath the red paint (that I'm sure is factory) the fount is chrome over brass. I was wondering why Tilley would have gone to the extra cost of chroming only to paint over the top. I'm guessing maybe they used their seconds from the chroming process for the painted founts.
Yes, plating failures were sent back down the line to be painted - generally the reason for rejection is pretty evident. Unfortunately, Tilley didn't see the need to prepare the hard chrome (actually, 'speculum' metal) to take paint so it usually started to flake off quite quickly. If I was trying to re-spray one of these tanks, I'd key the surface with some sort of fine abrasive and use metal primer before the top coat...
@Pauly Glad you had a generally successful camping trip and it is good old "red" saved the day. I too have a red which I purchased new in 1991 and is the only "new" Tilley I've owned. Although much maligned I have faithfully followed the instructions of 10 preheat pumps and 90 to full pressure when lit on this and all other Tilleys too and have never caused a fount to dish or blow. As @Tony Press said, a well serviced lamp and a good quality mantle make all the difference. With regard to your fount Tilley used to supply a chrome or speculum plated version in most incarnations however, if it didn't reach the desired finish quality they would generally over paint this finish. Damage limitation really. Please keep us informed of "reds" progress. Regards, Jeremy Edit: my post crossed with David's.
This is something I've noticed with X246Bs and some Bialaddin lanterns. For some reason, the vapouriser, burner and mantle just seem to 'like' working with each other and produce a very bright light. Possibly it's to do with manufacturing tolerances or somesuch… Knowing Tilley, cost limitation is more likely...
I have a couple of paint over chrome X246B lamps, which were looking tatty. The “quality” paint came off with no more than a thumb nail or a plastic scraper. Having removed the paint the flaws in the chrome coating were minimal, one has a couple of smears in the plating where it was not completely clean before coating, the other has a couple of small brass areas showing through.
So some more progress today. Sanded with 360 grit sandpaper to rough it up @David Shouksmith . Would have used maybe 240 but didn't have any on hand. Had 180 but I thought that would be too much. I also decided to dip them in a citric solution as some of the brass that had shown up had some corrosion and I've had problems with paint sticking properly in that situation in the past. Fine steel wool to take of the brass corrosion a few times during what ended up being a ten minute dip. Then I bent up some wire to hang these using the control cock and generator assembly (masked with tape) so that I could do the paint in one go including the underside of the base. Great day for painting in Brisbane today while drinking a Corona or two. By the way you can see there are now two lanterns. I acquired a 1978 red earlier this year in in worse condition than my 77 red so decided to do that one at the same time. I'm not sure which is which in the photos below but will be reassembling with all the right parts as the date stamps are still clear after paint. And here they are painted up. Paint still drying but really happy with the finish. They look better than the photo.
I had a good run at it again today even though I'm meant to be preparing for a new years eve party... Anyways.... it's the holidays. "Red" (from 1977) is reassembled, leak tested and up and running (noting the hood/burner is off another lantern - just wanted to make sure everything good). And below is the second red lantern (1978) that I resprayed the frame on as it was poor condition. This one was in very bad condition. I had resprayed the frame previously in a bulk lot of Tilley frames that I resprayed all at once (there is another thread for this). Today I've fully disassembled this one (lots of frozen bits), cleaned them all down, done a complete job on the generator and needle (heat/quench, carb cleaner, on the generator and light sand on the needle), and reassembled with all new seals. Then a leak test before again running tonight with another lantern's hood that already had a mantle. Just looked outside and these have been burning for about an hour now with no issues. Not surprisingly, the original "Red" (1977) is burning brighter than the 1978 red. BTW @David Shouksmith , yes the paving that ran around the curved lawn edge took a lot of cutting! I worked with the paver to get all of this done last year.
Obviously - take it out with you when you go first-footing and then you were preparing for the New Year's Eve party - assuming you go first-footing down-under...
“First-footing” is not a custom in Australia, even though there are quite a few families with Scottish heritage (mine included) here. Tony
