Some doubts about this Primus.

The critical part is that it locks the tool head down onto the NRV head. It cannot rise up or slip. That is why it works so well even on mangled or very tight NRV's

 

Yes, a locking tool is the absolutely best for these.
The soft brass of the NRV is no good for real force, and you seldom get a second chance if you start to mangle the head.
If the tool don't get a chance what so ever to climb of the head, much is won in the first place.
Here's one of my versions where you can adjust the support to make it fit tight even if the lead washer is missing or the NRV for some other reason sits higher or lower than meant for the (rare) original Primus lock-down tool.
Or perhaps if you have an apparatus with an off standard pump tube length:

 

That tool certainly looks neat and dedicated for the job, @Carlsson.
Is that a special tool that you bought somewhere or custom-fabricated?

 

@MYN
There is another problem with Primus and Radius lanterns and it is that the collar/skirt between the cage and tank easily get stress cracks or even crack completely.

Personally I always losen the nut that hold these parts together enough to hold the parts without to much tension.

Michael

 

It's custom made. I got tired of destroying NRV's many years ago, so I made a couple of improved versions of the original lock-down tool.

 

Thanks for the hint, @cmb56.
I'll keep that in mind.

@Carlsson,
I would have make a similar tool too if I have more than one such Primus with me.
Now I can imagine how these brass NRVs could be so easily damaged if the tool's not fitting enough. I don't have any spare lead seals and I certainly wouldn't want to tighten the NRV too much.
Perhaps some PTFE tape would do for the time being.

 

Surely you can find a piece of lead somewhere to punch out a little washer from?
Otherwise they often seal anyway. But NRV's that are tightened without a lead washer is often the ones that are tricky to remove afterwards.

 

As the Butterfly and other Pmax clones also use lead seals on their lower vapourisers and NRVs a piece of lead sheet may be a good investment. Very easy to cut, punch or file various sizes of seals from it.
Some modern lanterns use Viton or Nitrile rubber seals in the same places.

 

MYN, you said that you too worked in the electrical business, so perhaps you can get hold of an old cable that used a lead sheath?
If you peel off a bit of the lead, cut it along one side and then flatten it all out, you'll get a decent lead sheet for smaller washers.
I have done that myself at a couple of occasions, and it work very well.

 

Yes Christer, but the cables do not come with lead sheaths these days. Those having them are in use and there're no short unwanted sectìons lying around anywhere.
I could not find any lead sheets for sale around here. Only some lead strips, which are too narrow to be used here. Melting and rolling these uniformly into a larger sheet would be out of my means.
I might try Viton or perhaps a piece of HDPE or nylon washer to see if they work.

 

@MYN

If you don't have lead, you can use HDPE of around 1mm thickness (milk or ice cream container) for your NRV washer.

Cheers

Tony

 

Thank you for the re-assurance with HDPE, @Tony Press .
Lead would be my preference if I could find them soon enough.
I was having some thoughts about substitutes that fuel-resistant and way softer than brass to deform properly, yet tough enough to resist tearing apart from the 'frictional twist' that's going to be imparted upon it.

 

@MYN

HDPE is entirely acceptable for NRVs. See here:

Non-return Valve Washer. HDPE. Pack of 3 - The Fettlebox

Cheers

Tony

 

Thanks Tony.
I've been thinking about HDPE for sometime. They could easily be obtainable or made from everyday objects.
Otherwise, solid PTFE or Teflon is still within my reach here.
I could get copper washers easily but I find that these are not 'soft' enough to be desirably deformed without the threaded brass parts being over-torqued(too risky).

 

No, they are not sold anymore. But I was hoping you worked at a place where you often re-do, modify and modernise the installations and then the lead-sheathed cables probably would be easy to get hold of in the scrap bins.
The plant where I work was build in the 60's, and even if it is at a totally upgraded standard, many installations still are with the old cables, and due to the constant re-built of the different factory areas we got, I often see lead cables in the dumpsters.

MYN, since you can't get hold of these cables now, what I write below is more as a general description for all in here since the cable lead is a good source of sheet for those who can find it.
It's just to be seen as a general tip!
I went to the cable scrap yard, and was lucky to immediately find a suitable cable. Not a large one, but good enough: a 4x10mm.

It's just to peel off the outer, plastic layer to expose the lead sheath.
'Circumcise' it, then cut it lengthwise and flatten it out, et voilà: there's your sheet!
About 1.2 mm thick, which is good enough to most of the applications where a lead washer is needed. And so much easier to punch out a washer from than thicker lead. If a thicker washer is needed, you can always use two.

 

NRV's have driven me to drink more times than I can remember. Not that I care too much because I like a drink especially on searing hot days.

NRV's and the pips in the pumps. I can't stand them. I have a Gloria table lamp that I simply cannot get the pump pip to seal and a truly magnificent lamp has never been lit (by me) because of a lousy pip.

I can get beat up, 100 to 118 year old lamps to work beautifully, but a louse pip kills an entire lamp project on an 80 year old lamp.

Check Valves can be just as bad as NRV's to remove. I have a Lind-O-Lite that has defied every attempt for 6 months to get it out. I seriously considered taking a 9lb hammer to that lamp the last time I tried.

 

You can't do that to a Lind-O-Lite. They are far too good for that. Pitner and Lind-O-Lite are about the best engineering there was in the US and they are getting hard to find.

I just had the same problem with an early 1930s Standard. Came in the end after I filled the tank with boiling water and the metal expansion just eased the NRV enough to release it. ::Neil::

 

What a chance on the lead sheath, Christer. I've carried out such Plant modernization projects years back. Also some major cable replacement works after a fire outbreak. I've had a whole truck heap of burnt lead-sheathed and other armoured cables for disposal but not in any way having pressure lanterns as my interest during that period. What a regret.
I'll be on the look out for them this time.
NRVs can be finicky at times. Just that tiny little bit but it can have the final say whether or not, a lamp would work.

 

@Mackburner

Neil, OK, I promise to use the boiling water before the 9lb hammer. I might leave it for awhile before trying it because if it doesn't work and there isn't any Jack Daniels handy, I can only guess the type of rage I'll get into.

 

This cage/frame of this Primus was made from steel. It has some rust on it. Does anyone know what the metallic protective coating it should have originaly?

 

I'm not 100% sure, but believe it was tin. Probably hot dipped.

 

Thanks @Nils Stephenson,
I want to remove the rust without further damaging the coating or plating.
But before doing so, I was trying to figure out what metallic coating is on the frame.
Nickel, zinc, tin, chrome? Or something else? It looks somewhat tarnished in a way that is not characteristic of nickel or chrome. If its zinc, a citric acid dip would damage that as well. But if its tin, I guess its a little more resistant to citric acid.
I wouldn't want to scrub and further scratch it.

 

Some updates on this hybrid Primus:
I found a tiny pin hole on the generator after some heat-quench carbon removal routine. This I tested with 8bar of compressed air.

Since I did not have any spares, I had to braze it up with some silver-brass alloy with an oxy-acetylene torch. Not a neat job but it sealed that pin hole up.
No attempts to touch it up or smoothen it further as I wouldn't want to accidentally melt a bigger hole through the generator loop.
I did not polish the lantern. Just removed all the grime and red rust. Left the patina on.
I re-assembled the lantern except for the hood. Rubbed it with some WD-40 and machine oil to temporarily prevent flash rusting on the frame.
I've wrapped the end of the mixing tube where its attached into the brass burner cup with a piece of asbestos cord so that it does not leak or draw in air from the joint interface.
I also wrapped a copper antiseize impregnated asbestos cord around the air tube at the part with a hole that's not supposed to be there in order to seal off that 'additional' air intake. After that I lit it with its spirit cup preheater. Pumped up a few strokes and turned down the pricker rod just like for the usual Petromax-styled lanterns.
No flare-ups but a predominantly blue flame but a slight occassional tinge of

yellow during initial burn. The flame was actually much paler than what could be seen in these pictures. It got paler as it gets hotter.

Although I've doubted that this hybrid could in any way work, its actually doing fine up to this stage. I've not attach any mantles yet.
I did not turn the pricker all the way down either as the exposed flame would be long enough to lick the base of the cage frame and melt the solder.
I left it on for half an hour to see if the flame would suddenly flare up into yellow/sooty fireball. It didn't. Just remained a steady blue which kept the generator sufficiently hot throughout the test.
I finally release the air from the fount to shut down the flame.

 

Looking good. Maybe the jet is a bit worn, but it looks like it is worth putting a mantle on it. Did you find a number on the jet?

 

Good progress, Myn. The winning characteristic of this Primus burner is the excellent heat transfer that enables it to work reliably under a wide range of conditions.

I have a Primus 1001 that also has/had a tin dipped burner frame and collar. After cleaning I opted to spray paint the collar and frame with VHT silver paint. It may not be the original finish but it does protect against rust.
I'm sure the hole in the air tube could be mended with lead solder and a small piece of metal sheet; brass or whatever is available.
After that your Primus would be ready for Prime Time and a mantle

 

@Nils Stephenson
I couldn't make out the number on the jet. It might have been previously marred beyond recognition or due to heavy oxidation. There's something stamped on it though. I'll try to post a picture later.

@phaedrus42

Maybe its the extension on the generator where the burner cap is attached. Not too sure.
I've used the asbestos cord to block the hole as a temporary measure in case it was deliberately drilled for a purpose.(insufficient air draw, etc.). I can always remove the asbestos wrap easily should I find something amiss.
Perhaps I might permanently braze the hole up later.
I've not fitted in the mantle or hood for a full test yet.
I've assembled the unit and function-tested every stage in a way I understand the working principles of such lanterns.
Because this Primus is some sort of a 'heavily-hybrided' unit, I therefore would like to 'catch' any discrepancies along the way that would otherwise cause it not to work.
This is a somewhat unusual conversion of a 1050 gasoline-fueled Primus into a kerosene-fueled unit. The original fuel shut-off valve is no longer there and there're parts from a 1080 and a 1020.
All which are new to me. Anything could happen.
Surprising to myself, it seemed to work out quite smoothly without any real hiccups which I was expecting all along.

 

Myn,

I have often had great success of being able to make out hard to read stamps/marks by taking a photo of the stamp/mark then enlarging/zooming in on the stamping/mark.

 

Of course it works smoothly, it's a Primus.

 

@Matty
I try the zooming trick or a magnifying glass.

@Nils Stephenson
Glad you're saying that this is still a Primus after all the surgery it had gone through.

 

What I would like to know is why they did this in the first place. The end result ,light wise, is the same as having a 'normal' 1080. There has been a lot of work done with uncommon parts for that part of the world. A mystery that we will most likely never get the answer to.