As per the title I would just like to know more about the lamp I have. I have no idea about these lamps, the one I have has been gathering dust under my stairs for well over 20+ years. I acquired it when a local authority stores was having a clear out. Looking on the threads there are several different E41’s but don’t know which mine is. The only reason I know what make and model it is, is the operating instruction sheet. It looks as though it has original grey paint on it but some of it looks brass and was thinking of polishing it. Would that be detrimental to it? Thanks in advance Jon
Well it's an E41 for sure but there are more than several variations. A few years back at Newark we identified 14 variations and there could be more. They are perhaps not as common as the pile of 30 plus we assembled at Newark might suggest but they are out there and much sought after. They all date from about 1940 to 1944 ish and W&B just assembled with what parts were at hand. I never did list all the variations because a lot were just different colours and top cap shapes. It is enough to call it an E41 and I wouldn't worry about which one. ::Neil::
Thanks Neil On the top (sorry don’t know the correct name) I can just make out the initials AM and what looks like a crown if that makes any difference. Would it cause an problems cleaning it up and polishing it, I’m a little wary about doing anything to it that might reduce its value in the long term ? Thanks Jon
Nice original lamp, AM is Air Ministry, war time, take care of the glass, should do harm polishing it, will probably increase the value ...
That Air Ministry crown is sometimes found on those brass tops. Comes on the 300 models as well. Cleaning and polishing won't hurt the value but if you use the lamp the brass hood will just go black again in time. ::Neil::
Check with a magnet before stripping the paint as I think it could be a steel tank and cage. It's your lantern to do as you please - but the paint is original and once stripped, it is gone for good. So I wouldn't be removing it.
Thanks guys for your help, Is there anything specific to clean it with, is brasso ok to use? I have a bench grinder with a polishing mop, would that be too aggressive on it? Also having read the label on the reservoir it states that it’s made of steel. Would it be best to keep that with the original paint and patina, re-paint it or strip the paint off and polish it? sorry for these questions but would prefer to do the correct thing than ruin it. Many thanks Jon
Most people recommend Autosol, rather than brasso, as the ammonia content of brasso can possibly damage the brass. I've also found that 4/0 wire wool soaked with WD40 gets crud and tarnish off brass quickly,without being too aggressive. As for the painted surfaces; it's your lantern, but my inclination , as the paint is original and in good condition, would be just clean it gently and conserve it as much as possible. Most people tend to only refinish the steel tanks when they are rusty and have lost much of the paint
My advice, too. Kinda like, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it!" Some lanterns look like shi. When you get them and first thing I do is simply clear off the crud and then go over it real good for cracks, etc. Unless it's really ugly looking, I would, "leave sleeping dogs lie" Enjoy it for what it is: A piece of wartime history!
Ok Thanks everyone for your help so far. I’ve made a start polishing the top and is coming up well although it’s taking a while. I’m going to leave the reservoir as is, as the paint is pretty good. Are there any tips for conserving the paint ? thanks once again
The tank appears to be steel judging from what looks like part of a label. Magnet will tell for sure. My E41 lanterns is dated 1942. I restored it sometime ago. The tank is brass.
Hi George, the label On the tank does say it’s steel, and looking at some parts of it there is some minor surface rust. I’m going to leave the tank painted and preserve that part. The top is coming up nicely using autosol but it’s taking a while with all the crud that’s stuck to it. On the top I've been able to reveal a serial number H539123/41/C22B if that means anything, I’m not sure. I just happened to be watching an episode of salvage hunters where one of the guys was sorting through a load of junk and found a paraffin lamp. It was then that I dug out the lamp I have. Which led me to here. I didn’t realise that there was such an interest in them. If I’d known when I got mine I’d have saved several more.
Hello, Jon, Yes. This is the right place for good advice on lamps and lanterns. A real fount of knowledge. Good luck with your E41. They are, in my opinion, one of best, well made lanterns you can own!
If that instruction label is an original, it is even more rare than these E41 lamps. Most folks just focus on the main item(s), but the unique collector's stuff is in the accesories and packaging. This seems a lamp sold off en masse through some selected dealers after the war, and advertised like this: This illustration is a copy out of Ian Ashton's wonderfully illustrated book of the Willis & Bates lamps. The price(s) make me wince. Oh! And Happy New Year everybody! Mike
As far as I’m aware the instruction label is original. It came with the lamp, and that’s how I was able to identify the make and model. It’s not in the best condition unfortunately, it’s torn part way through but it is still attached. I’m away for a few days but when I get back home I’ll take a picture of each side and post it here.
That would be very nice Jon, please do. This site is a fount of knowledge thanks also to contributions like this.
Thank you Jon! Considering the age, vulnerability and a general dismissive attitude towards these labels it is short of a miracle this label is still here for us all to see. And in such a remarkable good condition. And thus more rare than the lamps I bet. Regards, Mike
A little story to go with how I acquired my lamp. It may upset some people, so I’ll apologise now but this occurred in the early 90s, well before the internet was available to most of us and also long before I was aware there was interest in these lamps. I was collecting some camping equipment from the local authority outdoor activity stores. I’d been there several times and got to know the store man reasonably well. On this occasion as I arrived at the store, the store man asked me if I could give him a hand with something. They’d had a new delivery of camping equipment and were having a clear out. Amongst the old tents and sleeping bags etc were 2 large plastic trays with 25 lamps on each. I know this as if borrowed a tray previously for a camp. He said that if I wanted one I could take one, in fact he said if I wanted the lot I could quite gladly have them. I wasn’t really bothered but being polite I picked up a lamp nearest to me, I didn’t even inspect it; and placed it in my car. The remainder of the lamps and camping equipment I’m afraid to say was thrown in a skip. From what I remember the majority had the instruction labels with them wrapped around the globe in a similar fashion to one of the images earlier in my post. I also know that the majority of globes weren’t cracked having borrowed them previously. Had I known the significance of these lamps firstly I would definitely have chosen the best lamp there, and secondly would not have let the others go. So once again sorry.
No reason to offer any apology Jon. If we know beforehand how things develop, we can travel the world with just a dime (to paraphrase a dutch saying). And realise that 95% - or thereabouts - of the E41's produced, are lost or scrapped anyway since 1940. Also, I like your story and am sure many members here could tell similar tales. It reminds me of a story how then already very rare AJS Porcupine racing engines were scrapped in the early 60's that now command 6 figures easily. No, I am glad you did take just that one lamp and now are able to share some photo's, the label and last but not least a fascinating story with us. I do hope you feel the same and perhaps will keep this lamp as the start of a modest W&B collection. After all, you have the (al)most difficult-to-get lantern already, plus that label! Mike
Thanks Mike, I know it’s if and buts so I can’t dwell on it too much. Just a shame. An additional part to that story is I had one of the little camping stoves that were going as well. I know where it is but it’s not easily accessible at the moment, but will definitely be getting that from it’s hiding place to find a little more about it. Definitely keeping the lamp, will be cleaning it up further and then it will go in my kitchen. Also been looking at other lamps so may well be the start of a little collection.
Just an update cleaned the lamp up and it’s looking pretty well. Still a few bits to do to get it where I want it.
Quick couple of questions I’m going to put the lamp back in working order, and rather than mess around initially trying to make the currently fitted parts work I’ve ordered new parts, but wondering about the knob on the jet cleaner. Is it a case of just unscrewing it and swapping it over to the new one ? Is there a way of refurbishing this original jet cleaner as it appears to be blocked, I’m assuming it should be clear when I blow through the pickup pipe. Many thanks Jon
