New style of Chinese mantles

Discussion in 'Pressure Lamp Discussion Forum' started by ColinG, Nov 24, 2019.

  1. HighlandDweller

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    I no longer have the mantles to take further readings, but I was using an ex Bundeswehr SV500 with a Mica Windowed LND probe which is very sensitive to alpha and the standard beta/gamma probe that is supplied with the SV500. The unit measures in both Gy/h and CPM, but I only paid attention to the CPM as the unit was calibrated using Cobalt-60 so the Gy/h reading is not going to be accurate. Alpha readings taken at close range were multiple times higher than other new stock Thoriated mantles and at a distance of three feet there was still a significant amount of beta and some gamma.

    I'm not someone who is scared of radiation, but I'm not an idiot either and without the ability to analyse these mantles using spectography I decided to err on the side of caution and dispose of them.

    I would always follow the advice of burning off any mantle outdoors as Beryllium is still used in the manufacture of all types of mantle. I still use other Thoriated mantles, but I usually keep them for outdoor use and stick to non-Thoriated peerless mantles for indoor use.
     
  2. Alby

    Alby Subscriber

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    I received 20 of these mantles.. so I found them to be as shewn correct in size but very FLIMSY when burnt off and the supporting tie thread .. 3 strand .. USELESS .. and too fragile.. They could not be worked on to make a two hole mantle for a Tilley/ Bialaddin or similar .. just about ok for a smaller 1 hole lantern with micro surgery I suppose... better off with the old style Butterfly types. :thumbup:
     
  3. ColinG

    ColinG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    This is exactly what I was concerned about.
     
  4. MYN

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    Haha...
    I'm sure we wouldn't want to happen, would we?
    Anyway, there's no reason for any sort of paranoid over the amount of radiation from these mantles unless we're abusing them.
    It'll only become significant if you're operating a factory producing them, especially on the health of the workers handling the chemicals daily as well as problems related to the disposal of waste materials.
     
  5. ColinG

    ColinG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    So, as a final report on the new style Chinese mantles with the pink tops, I've replaced the two that I originally fitted with green top versions and both lanterns are working perfectly again.

    Unfortunately I already ordered 20 more of the damn things which is annoying but at least they don't cost much.

    My next project is going to I be re-mantling an Aladdin loxon type mantle on an empty frame just to see if it's possible.
     
  6. MYN

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    I do not have the pink tops. How do they compare against the green tops, @ColinG ?
    Light output and colour?
     
  7. BigStevie

    BigStevie United Kingdom Subscriber

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    Hi Colin, be interested to see how you get on with fitting a mantle to the Loxon frame, they certainly know how to charge for them!
     
  8. ColinG

    ColinG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    The light output is very good, the colour was slightly yellow to my eyes but they are fragile and have very thin ties that are extremely hard to tie onto the burner. I fitted two: one to a Coleman 339 (kero) and the other to an AshFlash (naptha) and both blew holes in the fabric when they were inflated for the first time. Maybe I had a bad batch but 2 holes in 2 attempts is 100% failure rate!
     
  9. WimVe

    WimVe Subscriber

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    First results:
    Measured with mantle in its bag, after 10min.
    Used: an IM7001 FAG Kugelfischer with built in DT7002 probe.

    Meting-1.jpg
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2019
  10. MYN

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    Yeah, even the green tops have fragile tie strings. Very soft and hard to loop a knot around the burner. Easy to break them before a knot could be made. I've some experience with them that I would tie them a little loose. This reduces the chance of them breaking when you get the lantern operating at higher pressures.

    @WimVe
    You've got the readings nicely tabulated.
    How would you rate them? If I remembered correctly, a mantle from the Radius brand had one of the highest measured radiation recorded. There are various numbers being measured in the column "amount". I could see that the radiation counts for multiples are not necessarily a summation of individuals.
    You might want to add varying distances of the measuring probe from the mantles.
     
  11. Les Vaughn United States

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    Mistake and can't delete.
     
  12. WimVe

    WimVe Subscriber

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    The amount Is the amount of mantles I measured.
    Over three or better five you get more reliable measurement. However the counter tells me that the radiation is not a stable value but varies.
    I started with the CPS and uGy/h after each other and then noticed that these where pretty much the same. So to safe time I did not measure CPS for all the mantles.

    If you want to be precise you should measure one full hour and the you have the real hour value.
     
  13. Crater Eddie United States

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    My new pink top mantles haven't arrived yet, but my Geiger Counter kit did, so I had to try it out.
    The Chinese green topped "Star" mantles that came last year branded as Butterfly 4D seem as hot as a vintage Coleman Silk Lite mantle, and both seem hotter than my stash of Peerless mantles made before the switch. The Chinese red topped globular shaped mantles that came as Butterfly 41 (also from last year) are as inactive as current production Coleman 21's. I knew I should have ordered more of those green topped ones, they are nice and bright.
    Mind you, this is just a cheap Geiger kit, it has no meter, just a flashing LED and a pizeo which clicks with each hit giving a relative indication. But it's fun, and in this case a relative indication tells me what I wanted to know.
     
  14. MYN

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    I've never had the older Coleman Silk Lite mantles. Too bad they're no longer produced. At least we still have some current production Butterflies out there. I wouldn't light up the limited number of the vintage '1111' that I have or they'd be gone too.
     
  15. WimVe

    WimVe Subscriber

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    So what to do before Christmass with a flu attack ?
    You go measuring mantles !
    Some observations:
    - looks like in generall all mantles show more or les the same result somewhere around 0,50 - 0,65 uGy/h.
    - the mantles marked radioactiv (AUER) don't differ much in value.
    - I skipped the CPS because of time, every measyrement is 5 - 10min.
    - values are not stable, they go up and down over time. 0,1 up/down is normal.
    - Used: an IM7001 FAG Kugelfischer with built in DT7002 probe

    Besides the old AUER, I have no mantles that state non radioactiv or radioactiv ! So I don't have a real comparishment on one or the other.
    I thought the Graetz mantles which I got from a gay in Altena from the factory, must be radioactiv but they don't show very different (higher) values.

    Only the No Name brand mantles from the first measured batch show no radiation at all, value is like background.

    The old primus seems to win with 0.8 uGy/h.

    Meting-2.jpg
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2019
  16. MYN

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    Wow! Irradiating yourself to treat the flu with mantles? That's new...
    I'd reckon it brightened up the silent night.

    Merry Chrismas and go with the Primus!
     
  17. aephilli

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    I want to say I remember seeing a post on some forum years ago about rigging the mantle frame upside down on a pressure lantern (like a Coleman 236/237) and running it for a while to "set" the mantle shape for use on the Aladdin. Haven't been able to find it again tho.

    I really liked the green socks in the small order I first got so much that I ordered a bunch of 'em, but when that order got here, they were the pink socks. :rage:
    At least the "Butterfly" ones seem to "fill in as needed" when I "burn 'em in running" instead of burning and allowing to cool then running. Mantles from the same batch end up fairly small on small single mantle Coleman 200s & 242s, medium on dual mantle 228s & lamps, and large on the big single 237s & 236s.
     
  18. Crater Eddie United States

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    My pink top sock type mantles finally arrived. No branding, just stuffed in bags with a barcode and this code: "AAD166811001".
    The Geiger counter doesn't react to them at all, so I must think that they are not treated with thorium. I'll play with them on a couple of different lanterns this week and report back.
     
  19. Henry Plews

    Henry Plews Subscriber

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    @Crater Eddie

    The pink top sock type mantles that I got have the same code. My observations and opinion can be found here: New style of Chinese mantles

    Henry.
     
  20. Crater Eddie United States

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    I have to agree with much of what has already been said about these mantles. Those horrible little tie strings are just the worst ever, but dipping the ends in melted candle wax makes them a bit easier to tie. They do burn fairly bright if you manage to get them tied and fired up without blowing them full of holes.
    Oh well.
     
  21. WimVe

    WimVe Subscriber

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    And another one:
    Meting-3.jpg

    With some pictures:

    Continental Veritas web.jpg
    Veritas 6829 web.jpg
    Veritas fumar Eugeos web.jpg
    Famos 120cp web.jpg
     
  22. JohanOptimus

    JohanOptimus South Africa Subscriber

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    I purchased 20 of the green tops and have tried a few of them. While they burn very bright, they are not durable. Below some photos where a 249 and 639 have split the mantles lengthwise.

    They are fine for test mantles and light duty use, 20200220_192115.jpg 20200220_193846.jpg
     
  23. ColinG

    ColinG United Kingdom Subscriber

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    I've found the green tops far better than the pink tops... they split just like in your photo! The quality control and consistency of Chinese mantles can be a problem for sure.
     

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